{"id":118915,"date":"2024-04-09T12:51:01","date_gmt":"2024-04-09T16:51:01","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/?p=118915"},"modified":"2026-02-23T15:31:21","modified_gmt":"2026-02-23T19:31:21","slug":"151-peter-megan","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/151-peter-megan\/","title":{"rendered":"Episode 151. \u201cOur gas is about to get shut off, but I refuse to sell any of my 7 cars\u201d"},"content":{"rendered":"<p><iframe title=\"\u201cOur gas is getting shut off\u2026but I won\u2019t sell my 7 cars\u201d\" src=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/embed\/uokU4YVzerw\" width=\"100%\" height=\"400\" frameborder=\"0\" allowfullscreen=\"allowfullscreen\"><\/iframe><\/p>\n<p><iframe style=\"border-radius: 12px;\" src=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/embed\/episode\/11wxQ5YZgs1iUKUzNEEEEK?utm_source=generator\" width=\"100%\" height=\"352\" frameborder=\"0\" allowfullscreen=\"allowfullscreen\"><\/iframe><\/p>\n<p>Peter and Megan, 36 and 37, are married with no kids but severe financial stress threatens their future together. Peter has grown to resent Megan\u2019s unwillingness to seek a higher income. He\u2019s changed jobs, but won\u2019t consider selling any of their seven vehicles to alleviate their stress.<\/p>\n<p><strong>This episode is brought to you by:<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Pique Tea | Get up to 15% off and 12 tea samples at\u00a0<strong><a href=\"https:\/\/piquelife.com\/ramit\">https:\/\/piquelife.com\/ramit<\/a><\/strong>.<\/p>\n<p>Facet | Get affordable, accessible financial planning with a flat fee membership. For a limited time, the $250 enrollment fee will be waived when you sign up at\u00a0<strong><a href=\"https:\/\/facet.com\/ramit\">https:\/\/facet.com\/ramit<\/a><\/strong>.<\/p>\n<p>Viator | Download the Viator app and use code VIATOR10 for 10% off your first travel experience with Viator.<\/p>\n<p>Thinkific | The same platform I use to build online courses online\u00a0<strong><a href=\"https:\/\/thinkific.com\/\">https:\/\/thinkific.com<\/a><\/strong>.<\/p>\n<p>DeleteMe | If you want to get your personal information removed from the web, go to\u00a0<strong><a href=\"https:\/\/joindeleteme.com\/ramit\">https:\/\/joindeleteme.com\/ramit<\/a><\/strong>\u00a0for 20% off.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Links mentioned in this episode<\/strong><\/p>\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/78-courtney-alex\/\">\u201cI pretend things are fine, but we\u2019re 2 months from going bankrupt\u201d #78<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/75-jenee-dan\/\">\u201cWe 4x\u2019d our salary as COVID nurses. The experience haunts us. So does the money\u201d #75<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p><strong>Show Transcript<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>[00:00:00]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0We\u2019re a month behind on our mortgage, getting a shut off notice for our gas account. Our electrical account\u2019s in payment plan. Everything is so overwhelming for me. Megan, I\u2019ve asked you multiple times to try to help out more, look at different job opportunities, and I get the same answer, oh, I\u2019m comfortable where I\u2019m at. But we need more, and I just can\u2019t do this myself.<\/p>\n<p>[00:00:34]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Do you think that Megan understands the severity of your situation?<\/p>\n<p>[00:00:39]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I don\u2019t think so. No.<\/p>\n<p>[00:00:41]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I listen, but I don\u2019t listen at the same time, where it\u2019s become a repetitive conversation.<\/p>\n<p>[00:00:47]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0We get by, and that\u2019s just what we\u2019re doing, and I\u2019m tired of getting by.<\/p>\n<p>[00:00:52]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Peter, what if Megan never changes?<\/p>\n<p>[00:00:56]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I couldn\u2019t deal with it. I\u2019m not doing this anymore. I\u2019m still young. We got no kids. Maybe it\u2019s time to move on.<\/p>\n<p>[Narration]<\/p>\n<p>[00:01:06]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Meet Peter and Megan. They\u2019re in their mid-30s. They don\u2019t have children, and they are in very serious financial trouble. Peter wrote me in his application saying he was at the end of his rope. He didn\u2019t know what to do. Maybe he would even be better off alone.<\/p>\n<p>[00:01:23]\u00a0Now, as I go through today\u2019s conversation, I ask them questions to try to figure out what\u2019s really going on. I have a feeling you\u2019re\u00a0going to\u00a0be frustrated. I know that I was. But I want to emphasize to you how important it is to treat all of our guests with respect, including on any social media comments.<\/p>\n<p>[00:01:40]\u00a0That\u2019s what I expect for the couples who are brave enough to come on this podcast and share their numbers and their entire financial lives with all of us.<\/p>\n<p>[00:01:49]\u00a0Now onto the conversation with Peter and Megan.\u00a0I started by asking them what would be an amazing place that we could get to by the end of this conversation, and I want you to listen to their answers because they provide a huge clue as to how they both see their current situation totally differently.<\/p>\n<p>[Interview]<\/p>\n<p>[00:02:05]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Just knowing how to properly handle money, how to put it in different areas like bank accounts, like IRA type of things, savings, stuff like that, to better our future to where we\u2019re going to be happy.<\/p>\n<p>[00:02:23]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. Peter, how about you?<\/p>\n<p>[00:02:24]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I just don\u2019t want to be so nervous, and I\u2019m tired of being overwhelmed about everything. I was hoping for\u2013 put a little fire underneath Megan\u2019s\u00a0ass. I feel like I tried talking to her before, and I feel like I get nowhere.<\/p>\n<p>[00:02:47]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0How come the answers that both of you gave me are so different?<\/p>\n<p>[00:02:57]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Two different minds, I guess.<\/p>\n<p>[00:02:59]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I feel like whatever I say is like, yeah, no problem. Okay. Not getting any help there.<\/p>\n<p>[00:03:08]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0So you feel that Megan is disengaged with money.<\/p>\n<p>[00:03:12]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Absolutely. It\u2019s tough. I feel like I do a little bit of everything myself. So I need help.<\/p>\n<p>[00:03:23]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0So it\u2019s like, I want to help him more, but it\u2019s very tough when he\u2019s very like single-minded and him doing it, which I am fine with. If he wants to take full control of it, he can. Because I don\u2019t know how to handle that kind of stuff. For me, it would just be when the bill is due, you pay it whether there\u2019s money in there or not.<\/p>\n<p>[00:03:43]\u00a0Because I don\u2019t want them to go into like you owe money, like with a credit card, then you start accruing more interest when you miss your payment. Or with the utilities, if you go too long without paying, then you get the shutoff notices. Then that\u2019s a little bit scary. We\u2019ve never had that happen before. I just don\u2019t want to see that little piece of paper that says, final notice. Your utility will be shut off.<\/p>\n<p>[00:04:07]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay.<\/p>\n<p>[00:04:08]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0It just scares me.<\/p>\n<p>[00:04:09]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Why are you willing to go as far as letting your power get turned off before you make a change?<\/p>\n<p>[00:04:15]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Well, I would prefer it not to get shut off.<\/p>\n<p>[00:04:19]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay.<\/p>\n<p>[00:04:21]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Hopefully, I\u2019m going to do something, and I\u2019m going to try my hardest.<\/p>\n<p>[00:04:23]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Why hopefully? Why try? What is this?<\/p>\n<p>[00:04:26]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s me doubting myself.<\/p>\n<p>[00:04:29]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Take me back to being a kid. What do you remember about your parents and your relationship with them, especially as it relates to money?<\/p>\n<p>[00:04:36]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Nothing.<\/p>\n<p>[00:04:36]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0They never talked about money. Okay. What else?<\/p>\n<p>[00:04:39]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0No. Never talked about money. Never showed that we were struggling or anything. Always everything was fine. Bills were paid. So like I said, they never fought about it, never discussed it. So I never knew anything about it.<\/p>\n<p>[00:04:54]\u00a0My father was self-employed for years. He had a landscaping business. Him, it just never seemed to like money come up or anything. I still remember as a child, and he still does it to this day, he has usually a wad of cash like this in his pocket, so I never thought we were ever poor or anything, because he would sit there and just take it out and pay for something.<\/p>\n<p>[00:05:17]\u00a0So he never discussed finances with me at all. He just had everything situated. When I was 16 years old, I got my first vehicle, which was one of my father\u2019s vehicles that was a hand me down.<\/p>\n<p>[00:05:31]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm.<\/p>\n<p>[00:05:32]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Only way I can get it was if I had a job.<\/p>\n<p>[00:05:34]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Did you like making money back then?<\/p>\n<p>[00:05:36]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Well, I was a child, so I didn\u2019t quite understand it. It was just, okay, it\u2019s in a little box in my room. I need it, I need it. I don\u2019t, I don\u2019t. Because he never set up a bank account for me, never had me go down until I really started, I think when I worked at Blockbuster. This is going back years now where that\u2019s when I had to have a bank account where I was like, yeah, getting the paychecks every week. They got to go in there.<\/p>\n<p>[00:06:04]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Did your mom work?<\/p>\n<p>[00:06:07]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0She did. But when she was in her mid to late 30s maybe, she was disabled. She had a neuromuscular disease, which basically prevented her from working. She would basically be standing up and just fall. So she collected disability, Social Security, and my parents divorced when I was eight years old.<\/p>\n<p>[00:06:28]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Oh.<\/p>\n<p>[00:06:29]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Again, never had talking about money with either one of them, even when they were divorced.<\/p>\n<p>[00:06:34]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0When did the two of you meet? High school?<\/p>\n<p>[00:06:37]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0High school.<\/p>\n<p>[00:06:38]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Senior year.<\/p>\n<p>[00:06:39]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0When you dated, did you talk about money?<\/p>\n<p>[00:06:42]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0No, we dated very young. We dated our senior year of high school, and I moved out pretty early and got an apartment, I think a week before I graduated high school. It was all just figuring it out as we go.<\/p>\n<p>[00:07:00]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm. And you bought a house, correct?<\/p>\n<p>[00:07:03]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah, yeah. We own a two-family house. We rent out one side. It\u2019s a duplex.<\/p>\n<p>[00:07:08]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. How about when you made that purchase? Did you talk about money then?<\/p>\n<p>[00:07:12]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I did that all on my own.<\/p>\n<p>[00:07:15]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0And what age were you married at?<\/p>\n<p>[00:07:18]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a027, 28. 10 years dating. 10 years married.<\/p>\n<p>[00:07:24]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0When did you manage your own money, Megan?<\/p>\n<p>[00:07:29]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I don\u2019t think I ever did. Not that I can recall.<\/p>\n<p>[00:07:34]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0You think maybe that has something to do with what we\u2019re talking about today?<\/p>\n<p>[00:07:37]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Most likely. I don\u2019t know how to discuss money, how to basically pay bills properly.<\/p>\n<p>[00:07:47]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm.<\/p>\n<p>[00:07:47]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I need an insight on how to do this. That\u2019s my issue.<\/p>\n<p>[00:07:50]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What do you think\u2019s behind that, the fact that you\u2019ve never managed your money on your own? What does that tell us?<\/p>\n<p>[00:07:58]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0That I\u2019ve always seemed to rely on someone else.<\/p>\n<p>[00:08:00]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Yes. Who was it early on in your life?<\/p>\n<p>[00:08:04]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Well, my father for paying bills, but again, he never gave me money because I had a job.<\/p>\n<p>[00:08:09]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Still provided a roof over your head, right?<\/p>\n<p>[00:08:11]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm<\/p>\n<p>[00:08:12]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Even though you weren\u2019t earning much back then, even as a teenager, right?<\/p>\n<p>[00:08:16]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah.<\/p>\n<p>[00:08:17]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0And then how about now?<\/p>\n<p>[00:08:19]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Now it\u2019s relying on my husband.<\/p>\n<p>[00:08:21]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Even though you\u2019re not earning that much, you still have a roof over your head, right?<\/p>\n<p>[00:08:25]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Yes.<\/p>\n<p>[00:08:26]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0See any similarities?<\/p>\n<p>[00:08:28]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Yes. I rely on other people versus myself.<\/p>\n<p>[00:08:32]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Can you tell me a time where you were not on the same financial page?<\/p>\n<p>[00:08:36]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Probably bills. Basically, it\u2019s just trying to get like a credit card bill or a utility bill paid. But then it\u2019s looking at the bank account, realizing there\u2019s not enough money in there. So then the panic and freak out happens, and then Peter sits there and starts to try and figure out how to get money in there to help pay that bill. And it\u2019s like I try my best to finagle things and be a little frugal with money every now and then, but sometimes it\u2019s just not enough.<\/p>\n<p>[00:09:03]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What happens then?<\/p>\n<p>[00:09:05]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Then we get into a little bit of a disagreement about it, and we just leave it alone. And I\u2019m like, okay. I\u2019m like, well, what do you want me to do? I\u2019m like, is there anything I can try and do to help? He\u2019s like, I don\u2019t know. He\u2019s just getting overwhelmed and trying to figure it out, and it\u2019s like, I don\u2019t know how to help. That\u2019s the issue.<\/p>\n<p>[00:09:24]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0How long have you struggled with money?<\/p>\n<p>[00:09:26]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Probably a while.<\/p>\n<p>[00:09:26]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0My whole life.<\/p>\n<p>[00:09:30]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Why are we talking now?<\/p>\n<p>[00:09:33]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Things are getting deep.<\/p>\n<p>[00:09:36]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Like what?<\/p>\n<p>[00:09:38]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0We\u2019re just falling behind on everything, and I got letters coming in, my credit\u2019s going down, and Megan said we \u2018ve gotten shut off notices. I\u2019m at the point that I\u2019m about to give up.<\/p>\n<p>[00:09:58]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What does that mean?<\/p>\n<p>[00:09:59]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. I don\u2019t know. It\u2019s like I\u2019m trying to take care of everything and like I said before, I just need the help, and I ask for the help, and I feel like I get no answer, and we\u2019re just behind on everything.<\/p>\n<p>[00:10:18]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Do you think that Megan understands the severity of your situation?<\/p>\n<p>[00:10:22]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I don\u2019t think so. No.<\/p>\n<p>[00:10:25]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I listen, but I don\u2019t listen at the same time, where it\u2019s become a repetitive conversation where it\u2019s the same thing over and over and over again, and I guess I just block it out, like, hey, if I don\u2019t hear it, it doesn\u2019t exist type of thing even though it does exist. It\u2019s just I have to change my mind frame.<\/p>\n<p>[00:10:43]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Because just a few minutes ago you said, it\u2019s not like we\u2019re getting close to any shutdown notices, any electrical thing. That would be really scary. And then what Peter just said is, we\u2019re getting shut notices.<\/p>\n<p>[00:10:56]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. Which I have not seen.<\/p>\n<p>[00:10:58]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0We\u2019re a month behind on our mortgage, getting a shut off notice for our gas account, and our electrical account\u2019s in a payment plan. Everything is so overwhelming for me.<\/p>\n<p>[00:11:17]\u00a0Megan, I\u2019ve asked you multiple times to try to help out more, look at different job opportunities, and I get the same answer, like, oh, I\u2019m comfortable where I\u2019m at. And that really annoys me. I took the chance and went to a new career, a whole different trade. And that was life changing for me and made a big difference for us. But we need more, and I just can\u2019t do this myself.<\/p>\n<p>[00:11:52]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Yes, you have said that all before, and I do understand it, but like you said, I\u2019m just comfortable there, which I am. I\u2019ve been there for 17 years now. It\u2019s like I know the ins and out. I\u2019m afraid of going someplace new and having to start over again, possibly have a lower pay than what I have now because of minimum wage. It scares me to go to another job. It really does.<\/p>\n<p>[Narration]<\/p>\n<p>[00:12:17]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Honestly, this is difficult to listen to. They\u2019re in debt. They\u2019re getting shut down notices, but Megan doesn\u2019t seem to care. Her answer is, I\u2019m comfortable there. Some clues that I noticed, Peter basically came on this podcast so I could convince his wife to get a different job. Megan has been subsidized for her whole life.<\/p>\n<p>[00:12:37]\u00a0She grew up with her dad taking care of the money. Then she got married young. Peter became the person taking care of the finances. We see this on the podcast all the time. One partner, sometimes both, have no real consequences for their financial behavior. What does it really matter? They still have a roof over their head. Power is still on, at least for now. But because they don\u2019t have any skin in the game, they don\u2019t change.<\/p>\n<p>[00:13:02]\u00a0\u00a0Hold that thought. We\u2019ll be right back.<\/p>\n<p>[00:13:04]\u00a0Now back to Peter and Megan.<\/p>\n<p>[00:13:06]\u00a0Let\u2019s take a look at their numbers.\u00a0Their assets, $447,000; investments, $42,000; savings, $3,500; debt, $215,000, for a net worth of $277,700. Peter\u2019s income is about $83,000. Megan\u2019s income is about $31,000.<\/p>\n<p>[Interview]<\/p>\n<p>[00:13:29]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s tough. In my mind frame, I\u2019m stuck where I am, and I can\u2019t get out of it. I\u2019ve tried looking at other jobs, seeing what else is out there, trying to better manage our money.<\/p>\n<p>[00:13:43]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0How many applications did you send out?<\/p>\n<p>[00:13:46]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0When it was six months ago, it was three of them.<\/p>\n<p>[00:13:49]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Three?<\/p>\n<p>[00:13:50]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0We got into a big, huge fight and I stopped because I got frustrated.<\/p>\n<p>[00:13:54]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0I think you stopped because there\u2019s nothing really at stake here.<\/p>\n<p>[00:13:57]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0No, there\u2019s a lot at stake. I just don\u2019t admit it to myself.<\/p>\n<p>[00:14:00]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0And when situations like this arise, Peter, you pretty much handle it somehow.<\/p>\n<p>[00:14:06]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah.<\/p>\n<p>[00:14:07]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Does that strategy work?<\/p>\n<p>[00:14:11]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Obviously not. We get by, and that\u2019s just what we\u2019re doing, and I\u2019m tired of getting by.<\/p>\n<p>[00:14:19]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. Can I ask you, do you get by? Are you losing money every single month?<\/p>\n<p>[00:14:24]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. After I started messing around with the CSP and kept on updating it and like, oh, we forgot this, and, oh, we need to put this in there. And all of a sudden now it\u2019s like, yeah. Yeah, we\u2019re losing money.<\/p>\n<p>[00:14:40]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. You\u2019re in the red every single month.<\/p>\n<p>[00:14:42]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah.<\/p>\n<p>[00:14:42]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm.<\/p>\n<p>[00:14:42]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. So does it work?<\/p>\n<p>[00:14:47]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0No. Thank you.<\/p>\n<p>[00:14:48]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Sometimes the first thing we have to do to make a change is to acknowledge that what we\u2019re doing is not working. It\u2019s really hard to just give a point-blank answer like you just did, so I totally applaud you for that. Megan, is it working?<\/p>\n<p>[00:15:03]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0No, because even when he put it into like the calculator, I think we were 70, 80% in the red.<\/p>\n<p>[00:15:10]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah.<\/p>\n<p>[00:15:10]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0It was an eyeopener. Then it was okay, now we really have to figure out where to be a little more frugal with the money, how to cut coupons in a matter of speaking to save that couple of dollars to hopefully help save in the long run or if there\u2019s a really good deal on something, get it type of thing. And hopefully it all works out.<\/p>\n<p>[Narration]<\/p>\n<p>[00:15:32]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0I just\u00a0want to\u00a0cut in here to point out two things that I just heard from Megan. First hearing that they\u2019re in the red every single month on top of the debt, on top of the shutdown notices, her solution is, we need to cut coupons. Now, this is a typical response for someone who\u2019s never really engaged with their money before.<\/p>\n<p>[00:15:55]\u00a0They\u2019ll often present very simple solutions to complex problems that have built up over many years. Now, if Megan is serious about changing, I can show her the total picture of the situation. I can show them how they need to cut more than coupons, but I\u2019m not sure she\u2019s ready, and that\u2019s because of another thing she says.<\/p>\n<p>[00:16:16]\u00a0She says, hopefully it all works out. This is typical of people who grew up religious and\/or feel that they have very little control over their lives. They don\u2019t make a plan because in their experience, they don\u2019t really have much control over what ends up happening. They live for today. They rarely think about a plan for next week, much less next month, certainly not next year.<\/p>\n<p>[00:16:38]\u00a0Personally, I don\u2019t\u00a0want to\u00a0use hope for anything important to me. If there\u2019s something that\u2019s important to me, I want to take a candid look at the situation. Where am I today? I\u00a0want to\u00a0make a plan, always leaving a comfortable amount of buffer. And then I\u00a0want to\u00a0use overwhelming force to get there.\u00a0Okay, let\u2019s continue. And I have to tell you that this is the part of the conversation where my jaw really started dropping.<\/p>\n<p>[Interview]<\/p>\n<p>[00:17:06]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I got to say that we\u2019ve been pretty lucky with stuff. And I think that\u2019s why she keeps on saying that.<\/p>\n<p>[00:17:14]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0The Pontiac.<\/p>\n<p>[00:17:15]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Every time something goes wrong, all of a sudden something works out for us. I\u2019m on the marketplace like crazy. It\u2019s one of my addictions. I hit a big home run, and that\u2019s how I paid off the Corvette. I bought an old vintage car for $6,000 and wound up selling it for 25,000. I sold the car to a guy in France. And yeah, I didn\u2019t put much money into it, and I\u2019ve been a mechanic my whole life, and I consider myself a fixer or I could fix anything.<\/p>\n<p>[00:17:51]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Can you fix your financial situation?<\/p>\n<p>[00:17:53]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Well, that\u2019s the only thing I can\u2019t fix. That\u2019s why I want the call with you.<\/p>\n<p>[00:17:57]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay.<\/p>\n<p>[00:17:58]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0We can fix it.\u00a0Got to have\u00a0confidence.<\/p>\n<p>[00:18:00]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Eventually.<\/p>\n<p>[00:18:04]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay, tell me. Megan, I like that confidence. Knowing what you know, how can you fix your financial situation?<\/p>\n<p>[00:18:13]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Goes back to getting a better job.<\/p>\n<p>[00:18:16]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s that simple?<\/p>\n<p>[00:18:17]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Not always. It\u2019s getting a better job, learning how to, again, spend money differently.<\/p>\n<p>[00:18:25]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. You have cars, I understand. When you bought a car, multiple cars, did you talk about money then?<\/p>\n<p>[00:18:32]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I did. I think we have a total of seven vehicles. Big into cars. I remember going to work, and I bought a Corvette, and so I kept on driving by, seeing this car. And I try to let Megan know everything that I\u2019m doing, and I saw this car. I was so excited about it, and I told her I was going to buy it, and she got a little nervous about it.<\/p>\n<p>[00:19:01]\u00a0I was like, yeah. I was like, it\u2019s no big deal. I can take care of it. I could pay for it. And next thing you know, I wound up purchasing it. Got a great interest rate on it. At that time, my credit was great. Everything was doing good, and purchased car, no problem.<\/p>\n<p>[00:19:20]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0How much was the car?<\/p>\n<p>[00:19:21]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s a older Corvette. I think at the time I purchased it for 25,000.<\/p>\n<p>[00:19:30]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. What was the interest rate?<\/p>\n<p>[00:19:32]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I was at 1.8%.<\/p>\n<p>[00:19:35]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Oh, that is a good interest rate.<\/p>\n<p>[00:19:36]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. It was a home run.<\/p>\n<p>[00:19:38]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Is that car paid off now?<\/p>\n<p>[00:19:40]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0That car is paid off.<\/p>\n<p>[00:19:41]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0So you have seven cars. What other kind of cars do you have?<\/p>\n<p>[00:19:44]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I have a Corvette. I got a Chevy Silverado pickup truck. I got two 1963 Chevy Impalas.<\/p>\n<p>[00:19:56]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm.<\/p>\n<p>[00:19:57]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I got a 20 Subaru Crosstrek, and Megan has a Jeep Wrangler.<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:06]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0And the Harley.<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:07]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Oh yeah, we have a brand new Harley.<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:09]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Brand new means what?<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:11]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s old now. 2022.<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:13]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Two years old.<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:14]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. How much does a Harley cost when you bought that thing?<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:18]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0So that was a CVO, so that was almost 40 grand.<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:23]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Oh, what\u2019s the CVO? Is that the model?<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:25]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah, yeah. Street Glide, CVO, it\u2019s like the top of the line Harley.<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:31]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0That was 40 grand. All right. So I understand that your transmission just blew out, Megan, since we last spoke, so this is actually an interesting moment for us to talk about it.<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:45]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm.<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:46]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0First off, sorry the car went through that.<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:50]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0<\/strong>Thank you.<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:52]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0How are you going to handle a situation like this?<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:55]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Me? I have no idea. It literally\u00a0just happened a few hours.<\/p>\n<p>[00:20:59]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Did that fall to Peter?<\/p>\n<p>[00:21:02]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yes.<\/p>\n<p>[00:21:03]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah.<\/p>\n<p>[00:21:03]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Play this out for me. How would it normally go? Because I\u2019m sure you\u2019ve been married a decade. Things come up, things break. So Megan, in this case, your car broke down. So you come home, you tell Peter, and then what typically happens?<\/p>\n<p>[00:21:18]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I was a mechanic for 14 years. That\u2019s my little side hustle. I have a garage, and I am calling up the junk yard tomorrow to pick up a transmission, swap it out.<\/p>\n<p>[00:21:32]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0How much will that cost?<\/p>\n<p>[00:21:34]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I would probably get one for about three to $400.<\/p>\n<p>[00:21:38]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. And out of curiosity, why not just give Megan one of the other cars?<\/p>\n<p>[00:21:48]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0You got two vintage cars and my Corvette. My Corvette, I drag race, so that\u2019s not even street legal.<\/p>\n<p>[00:21:56]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. Okay<\/p>\n<p>[00:21:59]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0The truck is still lifted to get the\u2013<\/p>\n<p>[00:22:01]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah, she can drive the truck tomorrow. That\u2019s no problem.\u00a0But yeah, she doesn\u2019t feel comfortable driving it.<\/p>\n<p>[00:22:14]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm. Okay. So you don\u2019t talk about money that often. You haven\u2019t really talked about it much. When you do talk about it, it\u2019s, hey, I\u2019m going to go buy this $25,000 car.<\/p>\n<p>[00:22:26]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I\u2019ll be honest, I\u2019ve spent a lot of money on my race car, and that was in the past, and I\u2019ve been really good on that.<\/p>\n<p>[00:22:36]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Most expensive.<\/p>\n<p>[00:22:37]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0How serious is this?<\/p>\n<p>[00:22:39]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Extremely.<\/p>\n<p>[00:22:44]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What would you be willing to do to change your financial situation? I\u2019m going to ask each of you. Peter first, then Megan.<\/p>\n<p>[00:22:52]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I feel like I\u2019m doing everything that I can. Yeah, I can cut back on eating out and\u2013<\/p>\n<p>[00:23:03]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0I didn\u2019t ask you to justify it. I asked you how much are you willing to do in order to change your financial situation?<\/p>\n<p>[00:23:13]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I\u2019m willing to do a lot, but there\u2019s certain things that I can\u2019t do.<\/p>\n<p>[00:23:24]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Like?<\/p>\n<p>[00:23:26]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I can\u2019t get rid of certain vehicles and stuff like that.<\/p>\n<p>[00:23:30]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What else?<\/p>\n<p>[00:23:31]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0That\u2019s pretty much it. That\u2019s where I was scared about. I\u2019ve listened to one of your podcast, and it really hit home. I was at work, and you were talking to a guy who had a lot of motorcycles, and I\u2019m not willing to sell what I have.<\/p>\n<p>[00:23:48]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. In your pre interview, you said, I heard the episode where you told someone to sell his motorcycles. It\u2019s my biggest fear. I can\u2019t sell my toys.<\/p>\n<p>[00:24:00]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. I think that\u2019s it.<\/p>\n<p>[00:24:02]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Is that true?<\/p>\n<p>[00:24:03]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yes.<\/p>\n<p>[00:24:04]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Is your biggest fear selling your cars, or is your biggest fear running out of money and getting divorced?<\/p>\n<p>[Narration]<\/p>\n<p>[00:24:16]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Peter\u2019s referring to Episode 78 with Alex\u2019s five motorcycles, but we also heard the same thing in episode 75, the COVID nurses, where Dan used to be working at Walmart, saw a car, and that became his definition of success. Now, putting all that aside, is this a\u00a0fucking\u00a0joke? They\u2019re in debt.<\/p>\n<p>[00:24:36]\u00a0Peter tells me he\u2019s stressed out beyond belief. Megan won\u2019t get a new job. Then I find out he has seven vehicles, and not just any vehicles, not even just a Corvette, but a Harley. All right,\u00a0let me\u00a0take a deep breath. I need to calm down here for a second.\u00a0I understand that in America, cars are a huge sign of success to a lot of people.<\/p>\n<p>[00:24:58]\u00a0I get that. Just because it\u2019s not my thing doesn\u2019t mean that Peter doesn\u2019t truly value it. It\u2019s totally fine. Your Rich Life is yours. My Rich Life is mine. But to Peter, when I even bring up the topic of cars, he preemptively tells me he won\u2019t sell them because to him, selling one of those vehicles is like chopping off an arm.<\/p>\n<p>[00:25:22]\u00a0Selling seven of them, in many ways, it\u2019s like his identity dying. Now, I understand that, and I understand these cars are part of a Rich Life. But in order to live a Rich Life, you have to be able to afford the things you\u2019re buying. And I can tell when people are not ready to make a change.<\/p>\n<p>[00:25:41]\u00a0That\u2019s because when I ask, how much are you willing to do to change your situation, if you notice that he responded with pauses and qualifications and yeah, buts, that\u2019s not promising.<\/p>\n<p>[00:25:53]\u00a0We\u2019ll be back after these messages.<\/p>\n<p>[00:25:56]\u00a0Let\u2019s get back to the show.<\/p>\n<p>[00:25:57]\u00a0Next in the conversation, I moved on to their other expenses.<\/p>\n<p>[Interview]<\/p>\n<p>[00:26:01]\u00a0All right, fine. Your insurance, 330. Your car payment is 1,198. What is this?<\/p>\n<p>[00:26:08]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Car payment. So that is my Subaru and the Harley.<\/p>\n<p>[00:26:15]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Why are you breathing so heavy right now?<\/p>\n<p>[00:26:19]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Stressed out.<\/p>\n<p>[00:26:23]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Why?<\/p>\n<p>[00:26:24]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Don\u2019t know. It\u2019s just overwhelming.<\/p>\n<p>[00:26:29]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0We\u2019ll get through it together. How many years have you been stressed out about money?<\/p>\n<p>[00:26:34]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Since I moved out on my own.<\/p>\n<p>[00:26:36]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay.<\/p>\n<p>[00:26:37]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I moved out a week before I graduated high school. I had my own apartment.<\/p>\n<p>[00:26:42]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0How do you think that stress affects your health?<\/p>\n<p>[00:26:45]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Oh, it\u2019s not good at all. I know that for sure.<\/p>\n<p>[00:26:50]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0All right. I agree. I hate seeing you cry. I hate seeing you stressed out, breathing difficult. I don\u2019t want this. It\u2019s not good for your health. It\u2019s not good for your relationship. The fact that we\u2019re talking about this right now as I\u2019m staring at a $1,200 a month car payment is blowing my mind. It\u2019s like in your head, you\u2019ve created this mental prison, and you\u2019ve put yourself inside of it. And you know what else is inside that prison cell with you? Seven other things. What are they?<\/p>\n<p>[00:27:23]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I don\u2019t know.<\/p>\n<p>[00:27:24]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0You created your own prison cell and you said, I\u2019m not leaving without my toys, and you\u2019re in that prison. Look at that. Wiping away tears as we\u2019re sitting here talking about how stressed you are, how bad it is for your health, how bad it is for your relationship, and you\u2019re just looking out through those bars going, somebody help me get out. You can get out anytime you want. It\u2019s going to take changing the way you look at money.<\/p>\n<p>[00:27:51]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0It feels like I got to start all over though, sell everything and\u2013<\/p>\n<p>[00:27:57]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What\u2019s the alternative?<\/p>\n<p>[00:28:00]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I don\u2019t see that. I see that helping out where we\u2019re at right now, and it\u2019s only going to get back into that same situation.<\/p>\n<p>[00:28:11]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Two separate problems. One, it\u2019s like the house is on fire. Let\u2019s deal with the fire right now. Let\u2019s put the fire out. That\u2019s problem number one. Problem number two, what are we going to do about the apples that we bought yesterday and now the fridge burned down and we need some new apples? That\u2019s problem number two. Two totally separate problems. We got to deal with the fire first.<\/p>\n<p>[00:28:32]\u00a0Put that fire out, and then we will deal with all the other problems second. You have to change the way you think about earning, about speaking with Megan, about your expenses. Right now, you built your entire life around a few inanimate objects. I\u2019m not trying to demean the fact that you\u2019ve accomplished something amazing with these vehicles, the Harley, that stuff\u2019s impressive.<\/p>\n<p>[00:28:54]\u00a0But another way to look at it is if I did it once, I could do it again, but I need to put this fire out. And that\u2019s how I look at it. Let\u2019s keep going with your expenses. You pay $1,000 a month for debt. What kind of debt is this?<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:10]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s credit card debt.<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:12]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0How much is the credit card debt?<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:14]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I think it\u2019s about 40,000.<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:18]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a040,000. Okay. At what, 27, 28% interest?<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:22]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yes.<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:24]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay, so that\u2019s essentially just growing, right?<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:28]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yes.<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:30]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0And how much do you pay for your shop?<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:32]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0That\u2019s not on there. I pay almost 500 for the shop.<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:38]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Where\u2019s the money come from?<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:40]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0The shop pays for itself.<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:43]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Does it make a profit?<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:45]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yes, the shop does.<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:47]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Where\u2019s that income?<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:50]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I believe that strictly like on the shop.<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:55]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0How much does it make?<\/p>\n<p>[00:29:56]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0If I had to say on average, I\u2019d probably say the shop makes about, what, two grand a month, give or take. If we had to average it out month to month, and that\u2019s at high end of it.<\/p>\n<p>[00:30:07]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah.<\/p>\n<p>[00:30:10]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0And is that the money you use to buy the vehicles?<\/p>\n<p>[00:30:12]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yes. Either to help out for that stuff, or I consider it free money.<\/p>\n<p>[00:30:21]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What\u2019s that old example of Nero fiddling while Rome burns? Have you guys heard of this example? Someone\u2019s just fiddling on the roof while the entire city is burning behind them. Anybody feel like that\u2019s what\u2019s going on here? Ah, working on these cool cars in the shop. Meanwhile, house is burning down.<\/p>\n<p>[00:30:45]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0When you put it in that perspective, yes.<\/p>\n<p>[00:30:49]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0The shop is my safe haven. I could have the worst day at work and worst day at home and go there, and it\u2019s like everything\u2019s okay.<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:05]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. All right.<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:08]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s your zen time.<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:10]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0And supposedly, according to this, you can spend up to $521 a month on guilt-free spending. But you and I know that number\u2019s not accurate.<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:20]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0No.<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:20]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0How much are you spending on guilt-free spending?<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:23]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I couldn\u2019t tell you.<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:24]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm. Megan, you tell me?<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:27]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0<\/strong>800 to $1,000 a month.<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:29]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0At that point, we\u2019re just guessing<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:33]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Need to cut your expenses somewhere else.<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:37]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Phone, I guess.<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:38]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. Your phone is way too high.<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:40]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Well, we have four lines.<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:42]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Why?<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:42]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Watches.<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:47]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Why is it that everyone I talk to who\u2019s in financial trouble has watches? What is this? And then they have iPads with cellular connections. You have that too?<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:57]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yes.<\/p>\n<p>[00:31:58]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Wow. So this is a new thing now. Everyone who has tens of thousands of dollars of credit card debt has Apple watches and iPads with cellular connections. Never fails. Do you all know why you have those things?<\/p>\n<p>[00:32:14]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0For me, it\u2019s nice to see the time and who texts me, because if I\u2019m at work, talking to a customer and Peter texts me, he needs me to call him or something, instead of me being rude and flipping my phone out, I just flip my wrist real quick, see it, respond back, and continue on with my conversation. I\u2019ve done that plenty of times.<\/p>\n<p>[00:32:31]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0That\u2019s interesting. How come I don\u2019t have that? And I have a company with employees and people texting me all over the place. How come I don\u2019t have that?<\/p>\n<p>[00:32:41]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I feel like it\u2019s one of those gratification things, just something to have.<\/p>\n<p>[00:32:54]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Something to distract you from the mundane life.<\/p>\n<p>[00:32:57]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. I\u2019ve heard you say it before.<\/p>\n<p>[00:32:59]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. What else do you spend money on that distracts you from the mundane life? Watches?<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:09]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah.<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:09]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What else? iPads.<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:13]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm- hmm.<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:13]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What else?<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:16]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Going over your friend\u2019s houses.<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:18]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. Where is the money in that?<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:22]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Buying beer to bring over.<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:24]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. Eating out?<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:27]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm.<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:29]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What else?<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:32]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Spending stupid money on dog toys.<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:34]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Definitely. What do you have in your house? What kind of stuff do you have? If we looked at the living room, the closet, what would I see?<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:43]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Honestly, not much. No.<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:45]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0No? Just a saltwater tank?<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:46]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah, the saltwater tank\u2019s a big expense there.<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:50]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0How much did that cost?<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:51]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I don\u2019t want to say.<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:54]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0The tank and stand were free, so that helped.<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:57]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah.<\/p>\n<p>[00:33:58]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Is anyone going to tell me the answer? I find it hard to believe this. A guy with seven cars does not want to tell me the price of a freaking fish tank.<\/p>\n<p>[00:34:04]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I think we going to have at least three to four grand in there.<\/p>\n<p>[Narration]<\/p>\n<p>[00:34:09]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0This is a new one. We already know from this podcast that 100% of parents who have credit card debt cannot say no to their children. That is a done deal. It\u2019s documented. We know it. But today I finally crystallized the fact that almost everyone in credit card debt has multiple Apple watches and also an iPad with a cellular connection.<\/p>\n<p>[00:34:30]\u00a0Why? It\u2019s mass luxury. It\u2019s the feeling that you\u2019ve bought something really nice. But also, it allows you to disguise your luxury purchases with functional reasons.\u00a0You heard Megan do it when she said, I can use my watch to respond to texts instead of being rude using my phone. Same thing. When parents tell me their kids need an iPad with a cellular connection so they can stay in touch. Look, if you can afford it, fantastic.<\/p>\n<p>[00:34:58]\u00a0I want you to spend extravagantly on the things you love. But many of the people that I talk to simply cannot, period. Look at this. This is my iPad. It\u2019s five years old. Works perfectly fine, gets the job done, but even if I had a brand new one that I bought yesterday, I can afford it.<\/p>\n<p>[00:35:17]\u00a0\u00a0I couldn\u2019t stop thinking about this example, and the other day I was thinking about how so many people on this podcast overspend specifically on cars and housing, but I never, ever hear someone overspending on things like luxury hotels, which happens to be something that I like to spend money on.<\/p>\n<p>[00:35:34]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Why? I was thinking about it. Number one, houses and cars are visible. Deep down, we want people to look at us and think that we are doing well. And in America you do that with your house and your car. If others cannot see it, what\u2019s the point?<\/p>\n<p>[00:35:54]\u00a0Number two, it\u2019s what people around us do. There\u2019s mimesis at work. It\u2019s not satisfying to buy the most luxurious custom-made umbrellas in the world if no one else is doing it. And this is where culture and class come into play. If like Peter, everyone else growing up around you idolized cars, you\u2019re probably\u00a0going to\u00a0idolize cars as well.<\/p>\n<p>[00:36:16]\u00a0And number three, you can finance houses and cars. Almost everyone does. But very few people are financing a 2,000-dollar a night luxury hotel. Here\u2019s my point. We mostly buy what other people around us buy. We mostly value what other people around us value. That\u2019s fine. That\u2019s human nature. I don\u2019t mind it.<\/p>\n<p>[00:36:37]\u00a0But in order to buy these very nice things, you need to make sure you can afford it. And to speak to a couple where they\u2019re getting shut down notices, wages are being garnished, but they are unable to even contemplate selling these luxury vehicles,\u00a0this is mind blowing.<\/p>\n<p>[Interview]<\/p>\n<p>[00:36:56]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0I guess what I\u2019m asking for is for either of you to draw a line in the sand, because what I heard from the two of you was a lot of kicking the can down the road and a lot of, I hope things change. I know they won\u2019t get like that. I don\u2019t mind. You go to Vegas, you want to play a game, you hope you win the slots or something.<\/p>\n<p>[00:37:17]\u00a0All right. Have fun. 20 bucks, great. I don\u2019t hope that my power\u2019s going to stay on. I\u2019m not leaving that up to chance. I want to plan. I want to know, what is the line in the sand where we are going to make a change, a serious change. I\u2019m begging for that from either of you.<\/p>\n<p>[00:37:40]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I don\u2019t know. Yeah. I really have no idea.<\/p>\n<p>[00:37:49]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What is the real issue here?<\/p>\n<p>[00:37:53]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I don\u2019t want to change. I\u2019m stuck in my ways.<\/p>\n<p>[00:37:59]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0You sound very confident saying that to me.<\/p>\n<p>[00:38:03]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s unfortunate, but I am.<\/p>\n<p>[00:38:05]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Doesn\u2019t seem like it\u2019s that unfortunate. Not unfortunate enough for you to change.<\/p>\n<p>[00:38:10]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0No, but it\u2019s getting there.<\/p>\n<p>[00:38:11]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0When will it be there?<\/p>\n<p>[00:38:13]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Hopefully soon when it actually clicks in my head and after this conversation. It\u2019s going to really start to sink in and it\u2019s going to make me think of,\u00a0shit,\u00a0I suck. I don\u2019t know what I\u2019m doing.<\/p>\n<p>[00:38:25]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Are you guys happy with the way your lives are going?<\/p>\n<p>[00:38:30]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0No.<\/p>\n<p>[00:38:31]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Because if you are,\u00a0I will give you a couple of small tweaks. You can save a couple hundred bucks a month, and we can go on our ways. You tell me. If you tell me, I\u2019m almost 40 years old, I\u2019m getting shut off notices. I\u2019m spending more than I make every single month. We can\u2019t get aligned on money, and we need to make a big change, I\u2019ll help you make a big change. I will go where you want me to go, but you tell me.<\/p>\n<p>[00:39:05]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0We do need the help.<\/p>\n<p>[00:39:07]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah, we definitely do.<\/p>\n<p>[00:39:10]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0I\u2019m going to ask the question again. What are you willing to do in order to make a change?<\/p>\n<p>[00:39:19]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Anything.<\/p>\n<p>[00:39:20]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Be honest. Don\u2019t feel pressured by me.<\/p>\n<p>[00:39:25]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I\u2019ve worked so hard to have what I got, and I don\u2019t want to lose it.<\/p>\n<p>[00:39:29]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm.<\/p>\n<p>[00:39:33]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I grew up not having anything, and it just beats me up getting this far. I\u2019ve changed jobs, and I got a great job now. I\u2019m in the union. Great pay, pension plans and everything, and I got an annuity. Stuff that I\u2019ve never even known what was, and I\u2019m still learning about, and it\u2019s tough to give up the stuff that I work for.<\/p>\n<p>[00:40:10]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0And Megan, you said you\u2019re willing to change anything. Tell me more about that.<\/p>\n<p>[00:40:14]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0If I have to change my job, I have to change my job. If it\u2019ll make things better, it\u2019s just trying to find a field, which only thing I\u2019ve ever done since I was 16 years old is retail. So it\u2019s trying to find a job that\u2019s not retail is what scares me because I know non-retail jobs pay better than retail. I only have some college. I never completed college.<\/p>\n<p>[00:40:37]\u00a0So it\u2019s like I found a field that I like, have to have previous experience in it, have to have a college degree in it. And I\u2019m like, well this doesn\u2019t do any good. I know I can probably apply for it, but I don\u2019t want to go for it and then get heartbroken because I don\u2019t get it. It\u2019s like, I want basically a guaranteed job, if that makes sense.<\/p>\n<p>[00:40:58]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0No, it doesn\u2019t make sense.<\/p>\n<p>[00:41:00]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Well, I just don\u2019t want to quit my job and then go to another job where I\u2019m only going to be there for, well, say a couple of months before I don\u2019t like it and then not be able to get my old job back.<\/p>\n<p>[00:41:11]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Megan, I still don\u2019t think it\u2019s the field that\u2019s the problem. I think you just don\u2019t want to change jobs. You told me that, right?<\/p>\n<p>[00:41:18]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm.<\/p>\n<p>[Narration]<\/p>\n<p>[00:41:20]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Peter doesn\u2019t\u00a0want to\u00a0give up any of his seven vehicles. Megan doesn\u2019t\u00a0want to\u00a0get a new job because she\u2019s comfortable. But there\u2019s also another part of this story that you don\u2019t know. Let me rewind and tell you how we got here.<\/p>\n<p>[00:41:32]\u00a0Peter and Megan really wanted to talk to me. They wanted help. The first time we got on a call, they had a number of AV problems. It wasn\u2019t working out, so I finally said, you know what? We\u2019re\u00a0going to\u00a0call it, and I ended the call.<\/p>\n<p>[00:41:45]\u00a0Now, after that, they specifically reached out to my team asking for another conversation with me. Please note that in Peter\u2019s application, he wrote, I\u2019m only 37, and I don\u2019t want to lose our home. I\u2019m getting to the point where maybe I\u2019m better off by myself. He also wrote, it\u2019s causing me to not want to be home.<\/p>\n<p>[00:42:04]\u00a0I\u2019m working crazy hours just to pay minimums. It\u2019s been a problem for over 10 years and has only gotten worse every year. I just\u00a0want to\u00a0give up. I can\u2019t keep going on like this. And when Peter wrote asking for a second chance at talking, he said, I\u2019m desperate. I\u2019m now getting my wages garnished.<\/p>\n<p>[00:42:21]\u00a0I was happy to get on another call with them because I\u00a0want to\u00a0help them, which makes our conversation even that much more puzzling. How can they be so eager to get my help, but then when we get here and we start talking, they\u2019re not willing to change a single thing?<\/p>\n<p>[00:42:36]\u00a0We\u2019ll move on right after this quick break.<\/p>\n<p>[00:42:39]\u00a0Okay. Let\u2019s jump back into the conversation.<\/p>\n<p>[Interview]<\/p>\n<p>[00:42:42]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Peter, you filled out the application, correct?<\/p>\n<p>[00:42:45]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Correct.<\/p>\n<p>[00:42:46]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What was going through your head when you filled out the application to speak to me?<\/p>\n<p>[00:42:51]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I was extremely overwhelmed, didn\u2019t know what to do. I listened to the podcast like crazy at work, just panicked, and I was like, I need help. I have no one else to ask for help.<\/p>\n<p>[00:43:07]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0So if you change nothing, we end our call and the two of you change nothing, what happens? Fast forward for me a month, six months, and a couple of years.<\/p>\n<p>[00:43:16]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0We\u2019re screwed. It\u2019s going to be living paycheck to paycheck, struggling, not being happy, trying to figure out how to pay bills, have utility shut off, have the electric shut off or the gas shut off.<\/p>\n<p>[00:43:30]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Then what?<\/p>\n<p>[00:43:31]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0More credit card interest, and then it goes into collections, and then it hurts the credit score.<\/p>\n<p>[00:43:37]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Who cares about a credit score?<\/p>\n<p>[00:43:39]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I do, because I want to buy another house. Don\u2019t you need a good credit score for another house?<\/p>\n<p>[00:43:46]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. But what are you talking about a new house? You don\u2019t even have enough money to pay your current bills.<\/p>\n<p>[00:43:51]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0No. When we actually can do it once we get ahead.<\/p>\n<p>[00:43:56]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0So what else happens if you don\u2019t change anything? Power gets shut off, electric gets shut off. What else?<\/p>\n<p>[00:44:02]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0House gets foreclosed. Then we have nothing.<\/p>\n<p>[00:44:06]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Where do you go?<\/p>\n<p>[00:44:09]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0If we\u2019re lucky, a family member\u2019s house, where we can stay until we get back on our feet.<\/p>\n<p>[00:44:15]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What would that be like?<\/p>\n<p>[00:44:17]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Very uncomfortable. Dogs, we\u2019ll have to figure out what to do. The cars, if it\u2019s a worst-case scenario, sell them. If worse comes to worst, live at the shop. Won\u2019t be comfortable, but it\u2019s a roof, if we can\u2019t find a family member.<\/p>\n<p>[00:44:33]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. Peter, what do you think? What happens in a couple of months or 18 months?<\/p>\n<p>[00:44:40]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0This is where I get so frustrated. None of that would ever happen. I refuse to let that happen. And it\u2019s just me hustling and putting in more hours and doing everything possible to change things around.<\/p>\n<p>[00:44:56]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0No. It does make sense though, because putting it on paper with, again, we\u2019re 70, 80% in the red, and seeing that, it\u2019s like, no, I don\u2019t make enough money to help get us out of that with the credit card debt and the shutoff notices and utilities and the mortgage. Paycheck basically covers all of that. Mine\u2019s just play money, the little extra, if we need something for a bill.<\/p>\n<p>[00:45:21]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. Peter, what do you think hearing this?<\/p>\n<p>[00:45:24]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I don\u2019t even know what to say. I get so upset because, like I said, my side hustle is my shop, and I\u2019ll one Saturday\u2013 Megan gets paid biweekly\u2013 I\u2019ll make her whole paycheck and it just beats me up.<\/p>\n<p>[00:45:43]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Did y\u2019all see what the application said?<\/p>\n<p>[00:45:46]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Megan has it. No.<\/p>\n<p>[00:45:48]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0We never have any money left, and my wife needs to make more money. She went to school and has a dead-end job. She gets mad at me because I call it a high school kids\u2019 job. I probably think that calling her job a high school kid\u2019s job is not doing any favors, right?<\/p>\n<p>[00:46:09]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0We got into a huge argument over that, and I realized that was really beating her up. And I do apologize, and I\u2019ve told her that before, but yeah, it\u2019s tough.<\/p>\n<p>[00:46:25]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0You grew up poor, right?<\/p>\n<p>[00:46:27]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I grew up very poor.<\/p>\n<p>[00:46:29]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Where? Midwest? East Coast? Where?<\/p>\n<p>[00:46:31]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Buckle, New York.<\/p>\n<p>[00:46:32]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. All right. So hustling. How many times by the time you were 18 did you hear the word hustle?<\/p>\n<p>[00:46:42]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0That was it my whole life.<\/p>\n<p>[00:46:43]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm. Still have that, right?<\/p>\n<p>[00:46:45]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0100%.<\/p>\n<p>[00:46:47]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0I\u2019ll hustle. I\u2019ll work harder. I\u2019ll never let it get to that position because I\u2019ll just keep working. I\u2019ll work 24\/7 as hard as I need to, right?<\/p>\n<p>[00:46:53]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0100%.<\/p>\n<p>[00:46:54]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm. Does it work?<\/p>\n<p>[00:46:56]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0It gets us by.<\/p>\n<p>[00:46:58]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. You said something interesting. You said, we get lucky. We fall down, then something comes up.<\/p>\n<p>[00:47:05]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah.<\/p>\n<p>[00:47:06]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0But then you also said, but I\u2019m tired of it.<\/p>\n<p>[00:47:10]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s exhausting. It\u2019s very exhausting.<\/p>\n<p>[00:47:13]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0You\u2019ve kept it up until now. You want to double the grind and hustle twice as hard for the next five years. Can you do it?<\/p>\n<p>[00:47:22]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0No, I\u2019m getting old.<\/p>\n<p>[00:47:25]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0When you both play out what\u2019s very likely to happen in the next 18 months, what do you both hear from each other?<\/p>\n<p>[00:47:33]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Nervousness, questioning the future. What could happen, what can happen.<\/p>\n<p>[00:47:44]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What else?<\/p>\n<p>[00:47:45]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Scared.<\/p>\n<p>[00:47:46]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm.<\/p>\n<p>[00:47:47]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Yes. Petrified at times because I don\u2019t want to lose anything, because he did work hard for it all.<\/p>\n<p>[00:47:57]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0You are both scared. You even describe it as petrified, but you\u2019re also both very comfortable. Have you noticed that?<\/p>\n<p>[00:48:08]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I guess, to an extent, yes.<\/p>\n<p>[00:48:10]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Not an extent. You\u2019re comfortable in your job, which you\u2019ve stayed at for over a decade. Peter, you\u2019re stressed out. You\u2019re telling me phrases like, I just can\u2019t keep going on like this, but you\u2019re so comfortable. You just do what you know, which is to hustle. You tell me point blank, I won\u2019t sell the cars. That\u2019s everything I\u2019ve worked for. So you\u2019re scared, even petrified, but also comfortable.<\/p>\n<p>[00:48:34]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0If it came down to it, I have no problem selling the car.<\/p>\n<p>[00:48:38]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0When does it come down to it?<\/p>\n<p>[00:48:40]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I don\u2019t know.<\/p>\n<p>[00:48:44]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What needs to happen in order for you to be like, holy\u00a0shit, this is serious?\u00a0Does the power need to go out?<\/p>\n<p>[00:48:52]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0For the house to be foreclosed.<\/p>\n<p>[00:48:54]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay, so the house needs to be foreclosed before you go, oh my God, we need to make\u2013<\/p>\n<p>[00:48:57]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah, it would not get to that point.<\/p>\n<p>[00:48:59]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. I\u2019ll tell you what, why don\u2019t we look at your numbers, and let\u2019s talk through it. Maybe it\u2019ll shed some light on this. What happened when you did the CSP?<\/p>\n<p>[00:49:11]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Did the CSP together, and I felt like Megan was more focused on the games on her phone than the actual numbers.<\/p>\n<p>[00:49:25]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Because I play my games a lot and I don\u2019t pay attention to a lot of things.<\/p>\n<p>[00:49:29]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Why is that?<\/p>\n<p>[00:49:30]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0The games are my outlet on life, and it helps me calm down, relax, and get my mind going straight from going everywhere. But even when I did look at the papers, it was very, very confusing to look at and just see all of the red and the black, and I\u2019m like, I don\u2019t understand any of this, unfortunately. It was very confusing to me. But again, seeing all the red kind of put it into perspective, we\u2019re screwed in a weird way where it\u2019s a lot of debt.<\/p>\n<p>[00:49:59]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Do you want to understand it?<\/p>\n<p>[00:50:01]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I do. I\u2019ve tried looking at it, and I don\u2019t understand much of it. I\u2019m trying to look and see like, what does this mean, and I\u2019m not very good with finances and understanding numbers.<\/p>\n<p>[00:50:16]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0All right, let\u2019s take a look. Let\u2019s take a look at your gross monthly income. Megan, what is this number here, the combined gross monthly income?<\/p>\n<p>[00:50:25]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0That\u2019s the numbers before taxes.<\/p>\n<p>[00:50:27]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. What is it? Read the number up.<\/p>\n<p>[00:50:29]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a09,486.<\/p>\n<p>[00:50:31]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0$9,486. So did you know that as a household you make $113,000?<\/p>\n<p>[00:50:42]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0No, I figured it was like 70,000 a year or a month type of thing, or a year, whatever you want to call it.<\/p>\n<p>[00:50:49]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Peter, did you know that you make $113,000?<\/p>\n<p>[00:50:51]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I honestly thought I was under, I thought we were about 80,000.<\/p>\n<p>[00:50:57]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0And let me guess. A few weeks ago, you were like, if we just make 25,000 more, all our problems will vanish, right? Well, here you go. The Lord has delivered. What do you say?<\/p>\n<p>[00:51:11]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0We\u2019re screwed.<\/p>\n<p>[00:51:11]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Did the problems vanish? Are you telling me that maybe, just maybe, the way you feel about money is highly uncorrelated with the amount in your bank account? Is that what you\u2019re telling me?<\/p>\n<p>[00:51:22]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I knew this was coming.<\/p>\n<p>[00:51:24]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Hmm. That\u2019s so shocking. So seriously, though, what do you make of the fact that you didn\u2019t know how much you made, and it actually turns out to be more than both of you thought, and yet you are still in financial trouble?<\/p>\n<p>[00:51:38]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Scary.<\/p>\n<p>[00:51:40]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What\u2019s the lesson here?<\/p>\n<p>[00:51:44]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0That I have no idea what I\u2019m doing when it comes to money and finances.<\/p>\n<p>[00:51:48]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What else?<\/p>\n<p>[00:51:49]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I just assumed it was all sunshine and rainbows and everything works out.<\/p>\n<p>[00:51:54]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Are you willing to get a new job?<\/p>\n<p>[00:51:56]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Yes.<\/p>\n<p>[00:51:58]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0All right. That\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:00]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0My income doubling or tripling would make a big difference.<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:07]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What is your job right now?<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:10]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I work at Petco, so I just work on the floor, cashier, stock.<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:16]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0How long have you done that?<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:16]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Maybe 17 years.<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:19]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0You make $30,000 a year.<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:21]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm.<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:22]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What do you think about that?<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:24]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0No, it sucks. I admit that it sucks.<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:29]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Why are you still there?<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:30]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Because it\u2019s a nice job.<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:34]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s comfortable.<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:36]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm-hmm.<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:37]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s a little frustrating for me because we\u2019ve done this before. I feel like she\u2019s like, oh, yeah, I\u2019ll look at a couple of jobs, and then it\u2019s the same thing again.<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:51]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Do you know why she doesn\u2019t change?<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:55]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Because I\u2019m stubborn and stuck in my ways.<\/p>\n<p>[00:52:58]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0And?<\/p>\n<p>[00:53:00]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I\u2019m a moron.<\/p>\n<p>[00:53:00]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Comfortable.<\/p>\n<p>[00:53:02]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0No, you\u2019re not a moron. I don\u2019t believe anyone who comes and talks to me is a moron. I think you\u2019re actually responding very rationally to the situation around you, Megan. Peter, do you know why she\u2019s has not made a change with her career?<\/p>\n<p>[00:53:18]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah, I feel because I just wind up taking care of everything.<\/p>\n<p>[00:53:21]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. There\u2019s no consequences. Why would anyone change? Roof is still over the head. Food is still coming in. Still eat out. Why change? Got the phone working, got the games. You know the job market is fantastic right now? Are you aware of that?<\/p>\n<p>[00:53:39]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0No.<\/p>\n<p>[00:53:40]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Why don\u2019t you take this seriously?<\/p>\n<p>[00:53:43]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I do. I just, like I said, when he talks about it, because we\u2019ve talked about it so much, it just gets frustrating and annoying that when I get frustrated, annoyed, I shut down. I don\u2019t talk. I don\u2019t acknowledge. I sit there and quiet.<\/p>\n<p>[00:53:56]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Peter, what if Megan never changes?<\/p>\n<p>[00:53:59]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I couldn\u2019t deal with it.<\/p>\n<p>[00:54:01]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Well, it\u2019s been over 10 years?<\/p>\n<p>[00:54:03]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I\u2019ve told her before, so I was like, I\u2019m not doing this anymore. It\u2019s tough saying it again. But yeah, I\u2019ve been at the point that it\u2019s like, I\u2019m still young. We got no kids. Maybe it\u2019s time to move on.<\/p>\n<p>[00:54:22]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I want to stick it out with him and go from there because I love him to all ends of the earth.<\/p>\n<p>[00:54:28]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0You love him enough to engage with money?<\/p>\n<p>[00:54:29]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0<\/strong>Mm-hmm.<\/p>\n<p>[00:54:32]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I get frustrated because I tried talking to Megan and she comes out and says that she\u2019s worthless and everything like that, and I reassure her that that\u2019s not it. It\u2019s just going to try a little more. But yes, I absolutely love her, and I know she knows that because not that long ago, we almost got a divorce and we worked through it.<\/p>\n<p>[00:54:58]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Was that related to money?<\/p>\n<p>[00:55:00]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0No.<\/p>\n<p>[00:55:01]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What I want you to see is that you have delegated the responsibility of money and probably other parts of making decisions to somebody else in your life. Almost like when somebody\u2019s injured in a wheelchair and they can\u2019t walk for a while, and then they finally get up, their legs have atrophied.<\/p>\n<p>[00:55:23]\u00a0They need to rebuild those muscles. Well, your ability to make those decisions and to manage money has atrophied. It\u2019s actually never been built in some cases, and it actually makes perfect sense because Peter\u2019s over here saying, I\u2019m overwhelmed. I need help. But you are not picking up the ball that he\u2019s tossing to you.<\/p>\n<p>[00:55:46]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0No, I\u2019m more or less dodging it.<\/p>\n<p>[00:55:49]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Exactly. And do you know why you are able to dodge it?<\/p>\n<p>[00:55:55]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Because I do.<\/p>\n<p>[00:55:56]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0You do. But why are you able to? Let\u2019s say Peter, God forbid, got hit by a bus tomorrow, what would you do?<\/p>\n<p>[00:56:05]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Probably have to sell everything in order to survive.<\/p>\n<p>[00:56:07]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Oh wow. So you would suddenly\u2013 Peter, what\u2019s that reaction you just had?<\/p>\n<p>[00:56:12]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah, it\u2019s frustrating.<\/p>\n<p>[00:56:14]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Why?<\/p>\n<p>[00:56:15]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Because I work my ass off.<\/p>\n<p>[00:56:17]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Peter, in this example, you\u2019re\u00a0fucking\u00a0dead. Who cares about your\u00a0shit?<\/p>\n<p>[00:56:21]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Exactly.<\/p>\n<p>[00:56:23]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Is this a joke right now? Peter\u2019s looking down from heaven going, no, not the Corvette.<\/p>\n<p>[00:56:32]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Oh, he would haunt me.<\/p>\n<p>[00:56:33]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Who gives a\u00a0shit\u00a0about the Corvette? It\u2019s gone. Scrap that thing.<\/p>\n<p>[00:56:38]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I would be haunted by him.<\/p>\n<p>[00:56:40]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What is shocking to me about that is for the first time in over 10 years, Megan would be taking action and being decisive with him. None of this hopefully, none of this trying. It\u2019s like, this is what I need to do. Why is that?<\/p>\n<p>[00:56:59]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Because I have nobody else to rely on.<\/p>\n<p>[00:57:01]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Wow.<\/p>\n<p>[00:57:02]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s all me.<\/p>\n<p>[00:57:04]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0So you\u2019re telling me you could turn on a dime like that, sell everything, basically fix up all your finances in a matter of three or four months. All it takes Is your husband dying in a grotesque death? Is that it?<\/p>\n<p>[00:57:15]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s super frustrating to me because\u2013<\/p>\n<p>[00:57:18]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0I don\u2019t want to hear the same old, it\u2019s frustrating story. I\u2019ve heard it. Let\u2019s talk about the future. I know you\u2019ve told her. I know she didn\u2019t listen to you. I don\u2019t care about that anymore. I\u2019m focused on the future. Can we make a change without you having to die or leave?<\/p>\n<p>[00:57:32]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah, I hope so.<\/p>\n<p>[00:57:33]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Then how are we going to do it?<\/p>\n<p>[00:57:35]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I don\u2019t know what to do. I did everything I could myself.<\/p>\n<p>[00:57:40]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0<\/strong>No, you didn\u2019t.<\/p>\n<p>[00:57:41]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Yeah. I changed jobs.<\/p>\n<p>[00:57:46]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0<\/strong>You didn\u2019t do everything you could think of, not even close. In your head, you have an invisible box around your vehicles that doesn\u2019t count. How much could all your stuff be sold for if necessary?<\/p>\n<p>[00:57:56]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Probably about 40,000.<\/p>\n<p>[00:58:00]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0You\u2019re telling me you\u2019ve done everything you can except for selling $40,000 worth of items.<\/p>\n<p>[00:58:08]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0It would kill me.<\/p>\n<p>[00:58:11]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Mm. That\u2019s not what\u2019s going to kill you. Losing power, losing electricity,<\/p>\n<p>[00:58:15]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I would find it another way.<\/p>\n<p>[00:58:18]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0What way? Tell me.<\/p>\n<p>[00:58:19]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0Like you said, I do side jobs. Yeah, I couldn\u2019t sell my vehicles. It\u2019s not fair.<\/p>\n<p>[00:58:28]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Fair to whom?<\/p>\n<p>[00:58:30]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s not fair to me.<\/p>\n<p>[00:58:31]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Okay. Well, I can\u2019t change that.<\/p>\n<p>[00:58:34]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0No.<\/p>\n<p>[00:58:35]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Why are you so content to live so small? I don\u2019t understand why. Why are you so content that your entire life is all about a bunch of random vehicles you buy, stuff? Just stuff. I\u2019m sure these vehicles are meaningful to you. I\u2019m sure you dreamed about cars since you were a kid.<\/p>\n<p>[00:58:53]\u00a0I have nothing against cars. Good, inanimate objects, you\u2019ve bought. These freaking vehicles that are sitting there, they\u2019re costing you your health. They\u2019re costing you your marriage. They\u2019re costing your financial security. I don\u2019t understand how you can be content to let vehicles be the whole purpose of your life.<\/p>\n<p>[00:59:16]\u00a0<strong>Peter:<\/strong>\u00a0I\u2019m just nervous that, get rid of them, it fixes something for a little bit, then it\u2019s back at the same situation.<\/p>\n<p>[Narration]<\/p>\n<p>[00:59:27]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0You can tell that this isn\u2019t about cars at all. Earlier I said that selling one of these cars would feel like Peter cutting off one of his arms, and now you can see what I mean. He\u2019s breathing heavily. He\u2019s talked about divorce. He has late notices. But he won\u2019t even entertain the idea of selling one of his seven vehicles.<\/p>\n<p>[00:59:49]\u00a0This goes a lot deeper than it appears. And what is especially frustrating to me is his focus on the second order effects. You\u2019ll see that when he says things like, I\u2019m worried we\u2019d get back into this situation again. They\u2019re in grave danger right now\u2013 personal danger, physical danger, financial danger.<\/p>\n<p>[01:00:09]\u00a0You can\u2019t worry about what might happen later when your house is on fire, but he can\u2019t think that far ahead. He\u2019s living in the moment, retelling the same old stories, unwilling and unable to make a change. He says that he\u2019s tried everything, but he hasn\u2019t really tried anything at all.<\/p>\n<p>[Interview]<\/p>\n<p>[01:00:26]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Another way to say it would be, oh my God, Megan, I\u2019m so excited by this. I didn\u2019t realize that we actually have a path out of being stuck. If you can get a job, which I would love to see you do, and I have total confidence in you, I can start selling vehicles, put that towards our debt, and we could pay it off even faster, start to save more, invest more, take trips, do the things we love. We could actually get out of this black hole that we\u2019re in. Megan, you look a bit disconnected.<\/p>\n<p>[01:01:03]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0Well, the only tricky part is with the phone, which I know we need to get rid of the watches. I know it\u2019s frustrating, but with his shop, he needs the internet down there because of the security cameras.<\/p>\n<p>[01:01:16]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Megan, you\u2019re about to go bankrupt. Your husband has talked about divorce multiple times, and you are stuck on $50 a month for internet. Are you sure that\u2019s the right place for you to focus your attention right now?<\/p>\n<p>[01:01:29]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0No.<\/p>\n<p>[01:01:30]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0Where would you two like to go from here?<\/p>\n<p>[01:01:37]\u00a0<strong>Megan:<\/strong>\u00a0I\u2019m just at a loss for words right now.<\/p>\n<p>[01:01:40]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0I want to help you guys. I\u2019m just not sure if you really want my help.<\/p>\n<p>[Narration]<\/p>\n<p>[01:01:49]\u00a0<strong>Ramit:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0I\u2019m sensitive to the fact that money is political and there are systemic forces that make it extremely difficult for lots of us to succeed in our culture.\u00a0But they\u2019re almost 40 years old. They\u2019re on the verge of divorce. Their wages are being garnished. Their lights are about to be turned off, and they\u2019re not doing anything about it.<\/p>\n<p>[01:02:12]\u00a0I believe that you can acknowledge the need for systemic change and simultaneously acknowledge the need for personal responsibility. And Peter and Megan are not taking any responsibility whatsoever.<\/p>\n<p>[01:02:24]\u00a0In order to make a change, here\u2019s what they would need to do. Number one, get honest with the situation. They\u2019re in the red. It\u2019s getting worse every single day. Number two, what are the fastest ways to alleviate pressure? Sell the watches. Sell the 4,000-dollar saltwater fish tank, and immediately begin redirecting all the money from those sales and the garage towards their living expenses.<\/p>\n<p>[01:02:45]\u00a0Number three,\u00a0finally, the bigger changes, sell the vehicles. Megan focuses on getting a new job that pays more, and both of them start to spend time and attention on rekindling their relationship.<\/p>\n<p>[01:02:59]\u00a0I wish I could share their follow up, but we reached out multiple times and never heard back. Peter and Megan, I wish the best for both of you, and I still invite you to share an update from our conversation.<\/p>\n<p>&nbsp;<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Peter and Megan, 36 and 37, are married with no kids but severe financial stress threatens their future together. Peter has grown to resent Megan\u2019s unwillingness to seek a higher income. He\u2019s changed jobs, but won\u2019t consider selling any of their seven vehicles to alleviate their stress. This episode is brought to you by: Pique [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":8,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"content-type":"","om_disable_all_campaigns":false,"_lmt_disableupdate":"no","_lmt_disable":"","_uf_show_specific_survey":0,"_uf_disable_surveys":false,"footnotes":""},"categories":[290],"class_list":["post-118915","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-podcast-episodes"],"acf":[],"aioseo_notices":[],"modified_by":"Nasrin","_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/118915","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/8"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=118915"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/118915\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=118915"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=118915"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}