{"id":125717,"date":"2026-04-28T08:02:16","date_gmt":"2026-04-28T12:02:16","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/?p=125717"},"modified":"2026-05-05T07:26:13","modified_gmt":"2026-05-05T11:26:13","slug":"258-we-had-900k-now-were-100k-in-debt","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/258-we-had-900k-now-were-100k-in-debt\/","title":{"rendered":"258. &#8220;We had $900K. Now we\u2019re $100K in debt&#8221;"},"content":{"rendered":"<p><iframe title=\"YouTube video player\" src=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/embed\/BULS8oytUkA?si=cRWEiKfAqoWxRc58\" width=\"100%\" height=\"400\" frameborder=\"0\" allowfullscreen=\"allowfullscreen\" data-mce-fragment=\"1\"><span data-mce-type=\"bookmark\" style=\"display: inline-block; width: 0px; overflow: hidden; line-height: 0;\" class=\"mce_SELRES_start\">\ufeff<\/span><span data-mce-type=\"bookmark\" style=\"display: inline-block; width: 0px; overflow: hidden; line-height: 0;\" class=\"mce_SELRES_start\"><span data-mce-type=\"bookmark\" style=\"display: inline-block; width: 0px; overflow: hidden; line-height: 0;\" class=\"mce_SELRES_start\">\ufeff<\/span>\ufeff<\/span><\/iframe><\/p>\n<p><iframe style=\"border-radius: 12px;\" src=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/embed\/episode\/0kniF2r8blZOxXiwRxJbDR\/video?utm_source=generator\" width=\"100%\" height=\"400\" frameborder=\"0\" allowfullscreen=\"allowfullscreen\" data-testid=\"embed-iframe\" data-mce-fragment=\"1\"><span data-mce-type=\"bookmark\" style=\"display: inline-block; width: 0px; overflow: hidden; line-height: 0;\" class=\"mce_SELRES_start\"><span data-mce-type=\"bookmark\" style=\"display: inline-block; width: 0px; overflow: hidden; line-height: 0;\" class=\"mce_SELRES_start\">\ufeff<\/span>\ufeff<\/span><\/iframe><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Ramit Sethi of I Will Teach You To Be Rich talks to Kristina and Erin, a married couple who have been together for 10 years, raising two children in Toronto. They make good money, but they have no system for their finances, which has led to years of avoidance. They&#8217;ve accumulated $106K in debt and have only two weeks of savings. While Erin, the &#8220;stable one,&#8221; has a full-time job, Kristina\u2019s entrepreneurial journey has been marked by wildly inconsistent income, including a $50K loss on NFTs. They both admit they don\u2019t trust each other or themselves with money. Ramit helps them confront their fears, redefine their relationship with money, and finally start working as a team.<\/span><\/p>\n<h4><strong>In this episode we uncover:<\/strong><\/h4>\n<ul>\n<li><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> How Kristina lost $50K in NFTs<\/span><\/li>\n<li><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Why Erin struggles with &#8220;spending with emotion&#8221;<\/span><\/li>\n<li><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> The cultural component of their Catholic guilt around money<\/span><\/li>\n<li><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> How their childhood experiences influence their money habits<\/span><\/li>\n<li><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Kristina&#8217;s fear that her income won&#8217;t last<\/span><\/li>\n<li><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> The surprising truth about their combined income<\/span><\/li>\n<li><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Why they avoid tracking their spending<\/span><\/li>\n<li><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Their identity as &#8220;coach collectors&#8221; who avoid real change<\/span><\/li>\n<li><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Ramit&#8217;s &#8220;60-second truth-telling&#8221; exercise<\/span><\/li>\n<li><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Why they need to be aligned as partners to achieve their goals<\/span><\/li>\n<li><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> The true cost of credit card debt<\/span><\/li>\n<li><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Why their &#8220;guilt-free&#8221; spending is holding them back<\/span><\/li>\n<li><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Ramit&#8217;s radical advice on cutting fixed costs<\/span><\/li>\n<li><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> How they can quickly pay off their debt<\/span><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p>&nbsp;<\/p>\n<h4><strong>Chapters:<\/strong><\/h4>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(00:00:00) Introduction<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(00:02:40) Feeling stupid about money<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(00:05:23) Unspoken financial conversations<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(00:08:44) Fear that money won&#8217;t last<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(00:09:25) Lack of trust around money<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(00:15:16) Emotional spending and guilt<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(00:22:52) The impact of high fixed costs<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(00:27:00) &#8220;We work too hard to feel like we don\u2019t have anything&#8221;<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(00:30:45) Why past coaching failed<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(00:34:54) Childhood money lessons and scarcity<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(00:49:30) Goals for debt and savings<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(00:54:30) Ramit&#8217;s 60-second truth-telling<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(00:58:33) Fixing the Conscious Spending Plan<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(01:07:07) Aligning on a Rich Life together<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(01:17:35) How Kristina and Erin are going to get on the same page<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">(01:21:40) Why they&#8217;re afraid to talk about money with their kids<\/span><\/p>\n<p>&nbsp;<\/p>\n<h4><strong>This episode is brought to you by:<\/strong><\/h4>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">DeleteMe | Get 20% off all consumer plans when you go to <\/span><a href=\"https:\/\/joindeleteme.com\/ramit\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/joindeleteme.com\/ramit<\/span><\/a><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> and use promo code RAMIT at checkout<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Shopify | Sign up for a $1 per month trial period at <\/span><a href=\"https:\/\/shopify.com\/ramit\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/shopify.com\/ramit<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">LMNT | Get a free LMNT Sample Pack with any order at <\/span><a href=\"https:\/\/drinklmnt.com\/RAMIT\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/drinklmnt.com\/RAMIT<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Superhuman Mail | Turn your inbox into momentum. Sign up at <\/span><a href=\"https:\/\/superhuman.com\/podcast\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/superhuman.com\/podcast<\/span><\/a><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">..<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Have you or your partner fallen for a scam? Maybe gotten bad financial advice from someone who didn&#8217;t keep their promises? If so, I want to talk. Apply to be on my podcast at <\/span><a href=\"https:\/\/iwt.com\/apply\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/iwt.com\/apply<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n<p>&nbsp;<\/p>\n<h2 aria-level=\"2\"><b><span data-contrast=\"none\">Transcript:<\/span><\/b><\/h2>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:00] Kristina: I got really deep into NFTs. It went up to like 900 at some point.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:05] Ramit: $900,000. How much did it go down to?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:08] Kristina: Like nothing didn&#8217;t recoup.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:11] Ramit: You mentioned that you have $100,000 of debt. What&#8217;s the plan for this debt?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:16] Kristina: We don&#8217;t have one. Why we&#8217;re here feels like heavy.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:20] Ramit: If nothing changes in the next five years, what will happen?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:24] Kristina: I&#8217;ll probably be divorced.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:26] Ramit: Well, how does it feel to have found between 60 and $110,000 in your couch cushions\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:32] Kristina: wild? That&#8217;s a ton of money. Let&#8217;s make that work for us.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:38] Erin: We want to kind of be in more control of our own future.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:41] Kristina: We work too hard to feel like we don&#8217;t have anything at the end of the day to feel like we&#8217;re struggling to feel like we can&#8217;t figure it out.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:52] Ramit: I think I have an allergy. And that allergy is this godforsaken phrase that goes like this, investing feels like gambling. You ever heard this phrase, oh my God. The people who say this do not understand investing. They have never read a single book about money. They just hear the word investing and they know some crazy confusing phrases.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:01:12] Ramit: 401k sep IRA. So they equate investing to gambling in a Vegas casino. This is basically an easy way for people to justify not learning about investing, which incidentally is how the real wealth is created in this country. And what makes this even more confusing is that some quote investments actually are gambling.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:01:32] Ramit: They&#8217;re not really investments at all. They&#8217;re fads, they&#8217;re traps, they&#8217;re scams. Crypto rug pulls NFTs. Today I am speaking with Christina and Aaron, who have been married for 10 years raising two children in Toronto. They make good money, but they have no system for their finances, which has led to years of avoid.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:01:50] Ramit: And there have been losses around NFTs. I&#8217;m looking at their conscious spending plan. If you want my help with your own conscious spending plan, join my money coaching program at iwt.com\/money. Coaching assets, 64,000 investments, 228,000 savings, 5,000. Remember, they have two kids in a high cost of living city debt, 106,000, total net worth, 191,000.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:02:18] Ramit: And here is how they spend fixed costs. 79%, which is quite high. Investments. 1%. That&#8217;s a red flag. Savings, 1%. That&#8217;s a problem. Guilt, guilt-free spending. 19%. What do you notice about their numbers? And if you were me, actually, what would you do? Put it in the comments below. I&#8217;m curious, before you get any further in this episode, put in the comments, what would you do?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:02:40] Ramit: Well, let&#8217;s find out. Please meet Christina and Aaron. Christina, when I say the word money, how do you feel?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:02:49] Kristina: Stupid. I think just finances in general bring up that like sense of, oh, I&#8217;ve done something wrong, or I haven&#8217;t quite figured it out yet.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:02:58] Ramit: Why is that?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:02:59] Kristina: I equate money to numbers, and numbers to me have always been a problem since I started doing numbers in elementary school.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:09] Ramit: Okay. And when you say you feel stupid around money, how does that show up?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:12] Kristina: Frustration, because I fear I&#8217;m not gonna know how to answer a question or I&#8217;m not gonna know what the next step is. And I get frustrated when I&#8217;m trying to fill something out.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:23] Ramit: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:23] Kristina: Or like, spreadsheets are my nightmare. Thank you for that.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:27] Kristina: Wow. Yeah. They, it becomes very jumbled and I, I lose track and then I get really frustrated and I just wanna throw my laptop.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:36] Ramit: What about for the two of you, your relationship with money? How would you describe it?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:42] Kristina: My first reaction was like non-existent. Like it&#8217;s there, but we don&#8217;t really have a relationship with it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:49] Kristina: There&#8217;s unspoken conversations. There&#8217;s conversations that we know we should be having and we don&#8217;t. I, I think I&#8217;ll also included in the application, we&#8217;re avoiders, we want what&#8217;s best for one another, and it tends to be more in the moment versus the long term.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:07] Ramit: You have the money &#8217;cause somebody makes a paycheck and you can spend it at a restaurant or things like that.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:14] Ramit: But like, that&#8217;s it. No real connection to it. It&#8217;s just something we swipe our cards for. Is that what you&#8217;re saying?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:21] Kristina: Yeah. It feels like a, a means to an end. We like nice things. Um, we like getting the best for our kids. We like. Treating other people. But yeah, it&#8217;s been more of an imposition than like a, a support to us.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:37] Kristina: We don&#8217;t go on vacation &#8217;cause we don&#8217;t have money. We don&#8217;t own a home because we don&#8217;t have money.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:42] Ramit: Erin.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:43] Erin: Yeah. I would say like, we tend to avoid it until it comes to those big things. It&#8217;s impactful things where like, okay, you know, you need to have X to do X, um, when it comes to money and then we try to tackle it as we go.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:58] Ramit: How do you feel when we talk about this?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:59] Erin: Just that like sense of failure. I feel like we&#8217;re both like high performers in like every other aspect of life that sometimes it feels like failure and it feels very emotional. Like a tightening, like a tensing, the guilt and shame and just like, yeah, I just feel bad.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:18] Ramit: Are you, um, typically feeling guilt when it&#8217;s other parts of life?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:23] Erin: Yeah, I would say.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:24] Ramit: Okay. Yeah. Alright. You mentioned that you have $100,000 of debt, half of that on credit cards. Where did that debt come from?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:34] Kristina: Living like having to, we put a lot of things on credit cards. During my time as an entrepreneur, when we couldn&#8217;t afford something, we would just put it on credit card.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:45] Kristina: Okay. When I needed to buy something for the business or buy something for myself, I&#8217;d take it out my line of credit.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:51] Ramit: What a line of credit. Why that?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:55] Kristina: I don&#8217;t know. And I didn&#8217;t know the difference, to be honest.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:59] Ramit: What&#8217;s the plan for this debt?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:01] Kristina: We don&#8217;t have one. Why? We&#8217;re here.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:04] Ramit: Oh, we&#8217;re here. So that Ramit creates the plan and solves it for us.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:08] Erin: Yes. Yes.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:09] Ramit: Okay. Wow.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:10] Erin: That&#8217;s\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:10] Ramit: effective.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:11] Erin: To learn. To learn. To learn.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:12] Ramit: Alright. How does it feel to have this debt today?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:15] Erin: It feels\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:16] Kristina: like heavy.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:17] Erin: Yeah. Same. It feels, um. Heavy. And we know as interest rates and things, it&#8217;s doesn&#8217;t help either. Right? If you&#8217;re trying to move in the right direction and you&#8217;re stuck paying those payments, it&#8217;s, it&#8217;s not helping you move in that direction.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:31] Ramit: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:32] Erin: We have tried to do things and, but then whatever we&#8217;ve tried just hasn&#8217;t worked or hasn&#8217;t, doesn&#8217;t actually come to fruition. Like, that&#8217;s a good idea. We should do that plan. And then I&#8217;m a shitter, so I think part of when we&#8217;re talking about like the guilt and shame, immediately I go like, yeah, we should, so why?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:51] Erin: Like, what&#8217;s the deal?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:53] Kristina: We&#8217;ve sat down with a lot of different people in a lot of different instances over the years, but there&#8217;s a lot that comes with money for us. There&#8217;s a lot of shame. There&#8217;s a lot of, you know, I&#8217;m 42, I shouldn&#8217;t be having to sit down and have this conversation. All the things that we say to ourselves, and I know that oftentimes sometimes the story we tell ourselves is not necessarily reality.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:16] Ramit: You find yourself doing that a lot with money.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:19] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:20] Ramit: Until\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:20] Kristina: it&#8217;s really bad,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:22] Ramit: and then what happens?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:23] Kristina: And then we freak out.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:24] Ramit: Tell me about the tension in your relationship around money.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:28] Kristina: The tension is the knowing, the knowing that things are not great financially. The tension is the, the unknowing, unknowing, how to move forward.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:37] Kristina: And the tension is just between us. We don&#8217;t always know how to have the conversation together.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:45] Erin: I feel, um, tension in my relationship around money. I think because it&#8217;s been very, um, like, I guess not stable over the last number of years. I think what, um, Christina wrote in our application is very true.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:02] Erin: It&#8217;s been like very up and down and can be unpredictable. So I feel a lot of, um, uncertainty.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:09] Ramit: Mm-hmm. And who, who&#8217;s been more unpredictable you or Christina&#8217;s income?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:13] Erin: Uh, Christina.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:14] Ramit: Okay. Um, Christina, take me through your entrepreneurial journey. How long have you been an entrepreneur? Like\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:20] Kristina: eight or so years.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:21] Ramit: Okay. What&#8217;s the most that you have made as an entrepreneur?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:25] Kristina: Right now, this year that&#8217;s like 79,000. Year to date,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:30] Ramit: 79,000 year to date. How much do you estimate you&#8217;ll make by the end of the year?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:33] Kristina: Probably just under a hundred.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:36] Ramit: What do you do for a living?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:38] Kristina: Uh, I help people build their personal brands.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:41] Ramit: Okay.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:41] Ramit: Okay. Wow. I was wildly off on that one.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:43] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:44] Ramit: And Erin, what do you do for a living?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:45] Kristina: I work in marketing.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:47] Ramit: Okay. Christina, you said, I finally started to make money in my business, which is a great feeling, but we both don&#8217;t believe it&#8217;s going to stay. Interesting comment. Why don&#8217;t you think that the money&#8217;s gonna last?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:01] Kristina: It hasn&#8217;t lasted in the past.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:04] Ramit: Mm-hmm. Meaning?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:05] Kristina: Meaning it&#8217;s been when I&#8217;ve had money. I haven&#8217;t managed it when I&#8217;ve been making it for a period of time. I haven&#8217;t figured out how to make that consistently. It&#8217;s gone away.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:19] Ramit: Got it. And so deep down you believe that&#8217;s gonna happen again?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:23] Kristina: Yeah, I think it&#8217;s a fear.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:25] Ramit: Okay. Let&#8217;s talk about the word trust in your relationship. Do Christina, do you trust Aaron when it comes to money?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:33] Kristina: No.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:33] Ramit: Aaron, do you trust Christina when it comes to money?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:36] Kristina: No. Do\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:37] Ramit: each of you trust yourselves when it comes to money?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:42] Kristina: No.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:43] Ramit: Both shaking their head no. Gosh, that&#8217;s a pretty tough thing to say.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:48] Kristina: Yeah, it doesn&#8217;t feel great. I don&#8217;t think we&#8217;ve ever said that to each other.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:52] Erin: Yeah, not out loud.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:59] Ramit: Christina, why don&#8217;t you think Erin trusts you with money?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:02] Kristina: I haven&#8217;t been trustworthy with money. There&#8217;s a number of examples, but one of them is I&#8217;ve got really deep into NFTs and in that like crypto space, and I spent a lot of money, we didn&#8217;t have. I, on paper, made a lot of money. I was playing in a market, having no idea what I was doing, and blew a lot.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:26] Ramit: What happened when you found out, Erin?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:29] Erin: I think that was the first time and the only time that something like that had happened where I didn&#8217;t know about it, like our communication, um, about that. So yeah, it was, it was hard. A little bit of trust. There was just, I was unsure.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:46] Ramit: Hold on. How much money are we talking about?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:48] Kristina: Oh, like 40, 50 grand. It was not small.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:51] Ramit: 50 grand in NFTs?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:54] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:55] Ramit: And how much did it go up or down to?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:58] Kristina: It went up to like 900 at some point.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:01] Ramit: $900,000. Okay. And then how much did it go down to?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:07] Kristina: Like, nothing. Like didn&#8217;t recoup by any means. I didn&#8217;t sell, I didn&#8217;t know what I was doing. You\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:14] Ramit: held it?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:15] Kristina: I said I just held.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:17] Ramit: You held it to the moon. Except it went to hell.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:19] Kristina: Yeah. LFG, bro.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:21] Ramit: Wow. Um, you&#8217;re the first woman I&#8217;ve met who was involved in NFTs. I&#8217;m not, I don&#8217;t, I don&#8217;t, I don&#8217;t know if that&#8217;s weird to say, but I&#8217;ve never met a woman. I know. It&#8217;s\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:29] Kristina: not\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:29] Ramit: weird who was involved in NFTs. I know,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:31] Kristina: I know, I know. So\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:33] Ramit: you had f between 50 K to 900 K and then it went to zero effectively to zero.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:42] Ramit: Yeah. Yeah. When did you tell Erin what was the price when you, when you told her? I know it wasn&#8217;t at 900 k.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:48] Kristina: No, no. Hell no. I think before it was probably, yeah, way before that. But it was like, probably like double or triple. And I was like, all right, we&#8217;re good. Don&#8217;t worry.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:57] Erin: You told me once you had made the money back that you spent.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:02] Erin: So she didn&#8217;t tell me until it had kind of broke even, I think. Right. Um, I think you broke even. And then it was doing quite well. So there was also this kind of, for me, unexpected like, oh. Okay, but not knowing how volatile the market is. So I didn&#8217;t know anything about it. So\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:18] Ramit: what happened when it started to go down?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:21] Kristina: It happened really\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:21] Erin: quickly. Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:24] Kristina: And\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:24] Erin: it was very like\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:26] Kristina: when they say like it goes like bowl to bear overnight. That&#8217;s what it felt like.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:32] Ramit: Listen up you NFT bros. This is you. The only difference is she admits it and you&#8217;re still broke with your stupid avatar that you put on Twitter, but then changed it eight months ago.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:44] Ramit: I&#8217;m so mad right now.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:45] Kristina: Yeah, you&#8217;re allowed.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:47] Ramit: I&#8217;m supposed to be here to help. Not ran about NF. Oh no,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:50] Kristina: no, that&#8217;s\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:50] Ramit: all right. How&#8217;d you get the 50 K in the first place?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:53] Kristina: Uh, some was a line of credit.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:57] Ramit: Whoa.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:59] Kristina: Yeah, it was really up.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:01] Ramit: You still owe on that?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:02] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:03] Ramit: Okay. I appreciate the candor. I can see why Aaron, you would find it difficult to trust Christina around money.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:12] Ramit: I am curious &#8217;cause there was the reverse as well. Christina, you mentioned you don&#8217;t trust Aaron around money. Why is that?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:20] Kristina: I don&#8217;t necessarily think we need to spend as much on food as we need to spend on food.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:24] Ramit: Oh wait, you said you like to buy expensive food. Is that right? What is expensive food? Like what&#8217;s an example?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:30] Kristina: We buy organic bananas. We buy like $7 crackers. And\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:37] Ramit: now you&#8217;re speaking a language I can understand you&#8217;re talking to a guy who does not know what the hell an organic banana is or how much it costs. That&#8217;s not my, I mean, but talk to me about these crackers. What brand, what flavor, what kind\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:50] Kristina: they&#8217;re made outta sourdough so that they don&#8217;t have seed oils and preservatives in them.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:55] Ramit: Oh god. Oh god. And um, how much, how much do you get for $7?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:01] Kristina: Oh, like.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:02] Ramit: Like this much.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:03] Kristina: Yeah, like a cup. Probably\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:04] Ramit: half the, A cup half, half the bag is full of air. They&#8217;re like, we imported this air from the Himalayas. No, you didn&#8217;t. What else?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:13] Kristina: I don&#8217;t necessarily think that we need to gift everyone a gift. That one, a gift period, and two like that is like the most beautiful or expensive thing that, that, that stuff.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:28] Kristina: Is\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:28] Ramit: that a trust issue or? I disagree with how she chooses to spend money.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:32] Kristina: I think it&#8217;s, for me it&#8217;s a trust issue because we&#8217;ve talked about it, we&#8217;ve talked about how I don&#8217;t quite understand it or I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s like necessary. Okay. And it doesn&#8217;t change.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:44] Erin: I feel like over the past, like year or two, I&#8217;ve definitely, um, done my best to curb, my instinct to gift.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:53] Erin: So for me, I think I&#8217;ve also tried to explore where that like comes from. I&#8217;m a very emotional person. I lead with the emotion. So I think sometimes I spend. With emotion. Like I want this person to understand how much I appreciate them or, um, how grateful I am or how much I love them. So like, I wanna do this thing that&#8217;s thoughtful, but I&#8217;m not necessarily going to say like, oh, that&#8217;s too much to spend on that.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:16] Ramit: Can I, can I say that again? I just wanna make sure I&#8217;m understanding what you said. &#8217;cause you just spoke a language to me that was like, Martian, sorry, I&#8217;m a very emotional person, so therefore I spend a lot of money. Can you explain the two? They don&#8217;t necessarily follow for me.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:33] Erin: Yeah, no, I think something I realized recently is that I will sometimes, um, spend to try to solve things, whether it&#8217;s, um, like gifting or I&#8217;m anxious and I, if I get this thing that&#8217;ll help us in the house and like, you know, it&#8217;ll, it&#8217;ll be like, um, the solve of some kind, but it&#8217;s not the right thing to do if that, I don&#8217;t know, I&#8217;m, maybe, I&#8217;m not making any sense.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:59] Ramit: I don&#8217;t think you&#8217;re being honest with yourself.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:01] Erin: Okay.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:01] Ramit: What you&#8217;re saying is, I think if we were maybe peeling the layers back, we might say, I spend money sometimes because I&#8217;m anxious. Mm-hmm. Or because I&#8217;m worried, or because maybe I want somebody to like me or love me. How much of that rings true?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:15] Erin: Yeah.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:15] Erin: Yeah. All of it.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:17] Ramit: Okay. What you said is an interesting story, but to me it&#8217;s just a story. I am an emotional person. Aren&#8217;t we all, don&#8217;t we all have emotions?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:28] Erin: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:29] Ramit: And then the next part of the story was, and therefore I spend a lot of money. Well, why don&#8217;t we just flip that story and say, I&#8217;m an emotional person, therefore I, uh, invest 34% of my net income.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:40] Ramit: Why not that? If we&#8217;re just gonna pick a story, why don&#8217;t we just pick that I&#8217;m an emotional person, so I pay off my debt super aggressively. I&#8217;m an emotional person, so I talk about money every Sunday with my partner.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:49] Erin: That sounds good. Sounds like a better story.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:52] Ramit: You could choose our story. Yeah. Okay. With this lack of trust between the two of you.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:58] Ramit: Does that make it more or less likely for you two to talk about money?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:17:02] Kristina: I think you&#8217;re experiencing it. It&#8217;s like pulling teeth.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:17:07] Ramit: Yes.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:17:08] Kristina: It&#8217;s not knowing what to say. It&#8217;s not wanting to hurt each other&#8217;s feelings. It&#8217;s all those things.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:17:14] Ramit: Ah, not hurting each other&#8217;s feelings. I don&#8217;t wanna hurt her, but she doesn&#8217;t wanna hurt me.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:17:19] Ramit: And now we have this cycle, which is building upon each other.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:17:24] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:17:25] Ramit: It&#8217;s actually very difficult. Like we can look at all the numbers. I can give you some fancy math, abracadabra, but if the dynamic persists where nobody wants to speak openly and honestly, even to the point of saying when you do that, it makes me feel unwanted.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:17:42] Ramit: It makes me disappointed we can&#8217;t get anywhere.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:17:46] Kristina: Yeah, I think it&#8217;s true. I think it&#8217;s, if we can&#8217;t talk about it, we&#8217;ll never be able to change it.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:17:53] Ramit: Did you catch. I asked Christina and Aaron if they trust each other with money, and they both said no. Then I asked if they trust themselves with money also. No, they answered instantly.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:18:07] Ramit: No hesitation, and that really tells me a lot. When you don&#8217;t trust yourself with money, you cannot make good decisions. Every choice becomes a guess. You play defense, you second guess, or you just avoid it altogether. And that&#8217;s exactly what I am seeing. Christina lost $50,000 on NFTs money she borrowed from a line of credit, Erin spends emotionally to manage her anxiety.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:18:33] Ramit: Neither of them can talk about it without feeling like I&#8217;m pulling teeth, and I want you to notice that until they develop competence around money, which then leads to confidence, nothing else matters. I could literally fly to their house and give them a line by line plan and it would fall apart within weeks.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:18:53] Ramit: Unless they made these changes. Remember competence, then confidence. Let&#8217;s see what their numbers tell us. What was it like to do this CSP together? Wow. What&#8217;s that big smile, Christina?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:19:06] Kristina: Just the ridiculousness of the two of us tried to do something like that.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:19:10] Ramit: Why is that?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:19:11] Kristina: The way that I wanted to get my head around doing the conscious spending plan was I created a project in chat GBT that was gonna help guide us through what the, the conscious fessing plan.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:19:23] Kristina: Because I was so anxious about it, I didn&#8217;t know how to approach it because remember, it numbers make me feel dumb and if I feel like it&#8217;s gonna help guide me through it, then I feel like I can approach it better. But\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:19:35] Ramit: fair enough.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:19:36] Kristina: I overcomplicated it.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:19:37] Ramit: So then how did you resolve it?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:19:39] Kristina: We looked at the numbers and we plugged it in.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:19:42] Ramit: Okay. Alright. Well that&#8217;s great. I&#8217;m glad you did. Shall we take a look at the numbers from your conscious spending plan? Let&#8217;s see here. Um, Aaron, can you read. The words in bold and the numbers in full for this entire box please.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:19:58] Erin: Assets 64,000 investments, 228,251. Savings 5,000 debt 106,000\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:12] Ramit: total net worth.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:14] Erin: 191,251.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:16] Ramit: Alright. What do you think about those numbers?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:18] Erin: I love seeing it. I really liked the sheet a lot actually. But now what? Like where do we, where do we go? So I think I just end up looking at it and being like, I feel very lost and like\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:28] Ramit: okay to\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:29] Erin: do next.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:29] Ramit: That&#8217;s a candid answer. I appreciate that. And Christina, what about you?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:32] Ramit: What do you think about those numbers?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:33] Kristina: I think if you had said to me before this like, what are your investments? I would&#8217;ve been like zero. Nothing. We have nothing.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:42] Ramit: You have over a quarter million dollars in investments.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:45] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:46] Ramit: Why? The gap\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:47] Kristina: story versus reality.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:49] Ramit: Yeah. Yeah. Like when people are like, you know, oh my gosh, I live paycheck to paycheck.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:57] Ramit: And then I look at their numbers and they&#8217;re investing like over $5,000 a month, plus they have $4,500 a month on private school. I&#8217;m like, I&#8217;m going to kill you with my bare hands right now. Ramit Satie, bestselling author, convicted.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:21:12] Kristina: It&#8217;s not worth it, dude.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:21:15] Ramit: Yeah. Alright, let&#8217;s go on to the, the income part.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:21:19] Ramit: Christina, can you read me your combined gross monthly income, please?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:21:23] Kristina: Mm-hmm. 17,560.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:21:26] Ramit: That means your household income combined is $210,000 per year. By a show of hands, who knew that number? No hands have gone up in this room. Okay, cool. Um, how much did you think you made Christina collectively\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:21:43] Erin: a buck 50, maybe\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:21:44] Ramit: 150,000.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:21:45] Ramit: Okay. And, uh, Aaron, how much did you think your household income was annualized?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:21:50] Erin: Maybe just over a hundred, give or take, depending on where Christina was at.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:21:55] Ramit: Well, how does it feel to have found between 60 and $110,000 in your couch cushions?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:22:02] Erin: Surprising. &#8217;cause it doesn&#8217;t feel like it. &#8217;cause I think of the things we just talked about.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:22:06] Ramit: Okay, Christina.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:22:09] Kristina: Now I just wanna know where it&#8217;s all going.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:22:10] Ramit: Good. Are you pissed? Are you shocked? Are you disappointed?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:22:16] Kristina: I think more surprised and like that&#8217;s ton of money. Yeah. So let&#8217;s make that work for us. And then there&#8217;s a little voice in the back of my head that&#8217;s like, well, you don&#8217;t know how long that&#8217;s gonna last.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:22:30] Ramit: That&#8217;s the voice of scarcity. It never has. It never will.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:22:33] Kristina: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:22:34] Ramit: So money comes. Money goes. You better spend it right now &#8217;cause you don&#8217;t know what&#8217;s gonna happen tomorrow. That&#8217;s that voice familiar, right?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:22:42] Kristina: Oh yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:22:43] Ramit: $210,000 is an extremely high income at a. Pretty young age, like it&#8217;s great. It&#8217;s great.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:22:52] Ramit: What I would like to do now is to try to make sense of it. So let&#8217;s go and look at your expenses. Let&#8217;s look at where your money&#8217;s going so that we can understand. Then we&#8217;ll have everything we need. Fixed costs. Uh, Aaron, what is this number here?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:07] Erin: It is 79%.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:09] Ramit: Alright. Fixed costs are 79%. That&#8217;s a bit high. Uh, investments, what&#8217;s that number?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:14] Erin: 1%.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:15] Ramit: Alright, that&#8217;s pretty low savings. What the, it&#8217;s 1%, but the reason I&#8217;m saying what the, is not that it&#8217;s 1%. We could fix that. It&#8217;s that the 1% of savings is going towards gifts. There&#8217;s no money going towards like a savings account. The only savings are going towards gifts. That explains why there&#8217;s not much in savings.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:36] Ramit: It actually all makes sense. One plus one equals two. And then finally we have guilt-free spending\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:43] Kristina: 90%\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:44] Ramit: or $2,465 a month. Is that number accurate?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:48] Kristina: Yeah, I&#8217;d say so.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:50] Ramit: Yeah. Aaron,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:51] Erin: I, I think so. Link, if not, maybe slightly higher.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:55] Ramit: I wanna point out a couple things that came to mind for me. First off, um, you have two weeks worth of savings in your savings account.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:24:06] Ramit: Means if you stopped making money, you would last two weeks and you have two kids.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:24:12] Kristina: It&#8217;s kind of terrifying.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:24:13] Ramit: It&#8217;s pretty scary. It&#8217;s one thing if you&#8217;re like a single person and, you know, worst case you go back and live with your parents if you&#8217;re able to, something like that. But with two kids, you have a much higher risk.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:24:24] Ramit: The stakes are a lot higher. The next thing I notice is that within your fixed costs, I wanna go down these numbers very quickly &#8217;cause why do you have 79% on a $210,000 income? Well, let&#8217;s take a look. Your, do you rent or do you have a mortgage?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:24:38] Kristina: We rent.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:24:39] Ramit: So your housing cost is 25%. And what, uh, area or city are you located in?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:24:46] Kristina: Toronto.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:24:48] Ramit: Very expensive.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:24:49] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:24:49] Ramit: Alright, so 4,000 bucks, how does that stack up relative to your peers with two kids? Is that higher or lower than what they&#8217;re paying?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:24:58] Kristina: We&#8217;re the only ones that rent\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:25:00] Ramit: really.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:25:00] Kristina: We don&#8217;t know if we could have gotten a mortgage, we would&#8217;ve already bought for sure.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:25:04] Ramit: Okay. Damn that Canadian propaganda is powerful.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:25:08] Erin: When we looked into it, like say a couple years ago now I think we can get a mortgage based on my like steady salary At the time it just was nowhere near high enough to break into a market where houses, housing in general is going for just so much money.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:25:22] Ramit: Yeah. Still going up or what&#8217;s the, what&#8217;s the deal with Toronto housing?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:25:25] Kristina: It&#8217;s kind of flattened a bit, but our, our landlord&#8217;s just sold, so we got our eviction notice and we have to find a any place to live. Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:25:35] Ramit: How much is the market going for? For what you&#8217;re looking for?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:25:38] Kristina: Uh, well, we&#8217;re gonna get less for paying more, so it will be typically over like four grand.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:25:45] Ramit: Over four again.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:25:46] Ramit: How many bedrooms do you have?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:25:47] Kristina: Right now we have three, two and a half? Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:25:51] Ramit: Hmm. Okay. Um, so that&#8217;s notable at 25%. Not bad. Not bad. For a high cost of living city, we often see that number higher. Childcare at 1500 bucks a month. That&#8217;s pretty pricey, there&#8217;s no doubt about that. And then, uh, debt payments at 1200 bucks a month.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:13] Ramit: And is that the minimum?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:14] Kristina: Yeah, like it fluctuates, but yeah, that&#8217;s the minimum.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:17] Ramit: So, so we&#8217;re looking into your debt of $106,000. I see. Aaron line of credit, Christina line of credit, Aaron credit card, Christina credit card and monthly interest is approximately $1,200 for this debt. How long will it take you to pay that off?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:35] Erin: I have no idea. Never. Never is, it doesn&#8217;t make it dent.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:40] Ramit: Yeah, I mean, we could calculate it, but it would be decades if ever.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:44] Erin: Yeah. Can,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:45] Ramit: can I ask a really blunt question?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:47] Kristina: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:47] Ramit: Who the hell makes $210,000 and pays debt forever?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:51] Kristina: I don&#8217;t know if it&#8217;s normal, but it doesn&#8217;t feel right.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:54] Ramit: No, it&#8217;s not. Do you ever feel like I&#8217;m sick of this?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:27:00] Kristina: Yeah. Yeah. All the ton. It feels like we work too hard. Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:27:04] Ramit: Tell me, we\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:27:05] Kristina: just, we work too hard to feel like we don&#8217;t have anything at the end of the day to feel like we&#8217;re struggling to feel like we can&#8217;t figure the out.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:27:15] Ramit: Hmm. I like hearing this. It&#8217;s the first time I&#8217;m hearing it. Like if you think about it, when we started the conversation, it was a lot of like, yeah, this is kind of a nuisance.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:27:25] Ramit: It&#8217;s slightly irritating, which is one thing, but if you&#8217;re like this, like, I&#8217;m sick of this. We work too hard. This is unacceptable. We&#8217;re gonna make a change that&#8217;s different.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:27:38] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:27:39] Erin: Yeah, we&#8217;re definitely at the point where we wanna move, having a nerve to change. And I think what we&#8217;ve realized about being renters now with two kids is it&#8217;s a stability piece, right?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:27:50] Erin: Mm-hmm. Like the kids are a lot like older moving and it&#8217;s, it&#8217;s harder, it&#8217;s harder to feel like you&#8217;re not in control\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:27:56] Ramit: Yeah. Of\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:27:57] Erin: any of that. So I feel like that has really been like, challenging, tough, upsetting, and we wanna kind of be in more control of our own future.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:09] Ramit: Ooh. I like that. Now you all have engaged with other people before.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:14] Ramit: In fact, I saw it repeatedly in your application. We&#8217;ve worked with multiple people before. Who are these people?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:20] Kristina: Like I have had a money mindset coach who was very helpful.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:25] Ramit: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:27] Kristina: We worked with, uh, like a financial coach previously.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:31] Ramit: What happened?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:32] Kristina: Nothing we don&#8217;t talk about. So it just falls with a, because we don&#8217;t.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:37] Kristina: Prioritize it and we don&#8217;t, we haven&#8217;t known how to talk about it and we don&#8217;t wanna hurt each other&#8217;s feelings. Like it felt like we were doing it, but it wasn&#8217;t, it didn&#8217;t feel like we were a team doing it. We were just kind of sitting beside each other.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:50] Ramit: Right. Powerful. That&#8217;s a powerful metaphor. The two of you were in the room, you were physically there.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:56] Ramit: You may have even been sitting next to each other, but you were still not a team.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:00] Erin: Agreed.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:01] Ramit: Aaron, what do you think? What people have you seen and what happened with them?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:07] Erin: I don&#8217;t know. Like I am, I don&#8217;t know. It&#8217;s failure, like it just all feels like we tried and I haven&#8217;t been able to do it. So it just didn&#8217;t feel like good enough.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:16] Erin: No, I don&#8217;t wanna get emotional.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:17] Ramit: Why not?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:19] Erin: Yeah, it just, it feels hard. It feels like we&#8217;ve tried and it&#8217;s just like, I think we&#8217;re stuck in a cycle that&#8217;s not gonna end until we end it. So\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:27] Ramit: yeah, it&#8217;s\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:28] Erin: end it.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:29] Ramit: What makes today different? Why is it gonna be different today?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:32] Kristina: Well. I won&#8217;t speak for error, but I&#8217;m just fed up and nothing changes until something changes.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:40] Kristina: We can&#8217;t keep doing the same and expecting different results.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:43] Ramit: But you did it for a long time.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:45] Kristina: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:47] Ramit: You still got the roof over your head, the food, so it wasn&#8217;t that bad. Right?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:54] Kristina: Yeah. But I think I mentioned it in our application, like we&#8217;re so stressed all the time, like we are, we&#8217;re sick. We don&#8217;t have time to do the, that we wanna do.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:04] Kristina: Like it&#8217;s not without its consequences.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:07] Ramit: Okay. The good news and the tough news is that the two of you are a team, and as you&#8217;ve told me, you are an effective team in other parts of life, but not in money. That can be good and that can be tough. Good in that if you get this to work, the two of you can row your boat way faster together than ever.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:30] Ramit: Solo. Mm-hmm. The tough news is that it&#8217;s gonna be tough. &#8217;cause not only do you each have to change yourselves, you have to change your dynamic together.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:38] Kristina: I think I would like that. I don&#8217;t think that we have been able to do that in the past, effectively.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:45] Ramit: So they&#8217;ve worked with multiple coaches before. A money mindset coach, a financial coach.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:53] Ramit: Why am I any different? My question is, what happened with all those other people? Here&#8217;s what I think happened, because I have worked with many people who are coach collectors. They go from this coach to that, from this conference to that, this program, to that. The people who jump around a lot tend not to make major changes.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:31:14] Ramit: Here&#8217;s what I suspect happened the last time. They hired a coach, they showed up, sat next to each other, nodded along, and then nothing. They went through the motions. They performed, but they never actually engaged. It&#8217;s like this really peculiar dynamic I&#8217;ve noticed on Instagram. People will DM me, they&#8217;ve been reading my site for years, and then they will send me a DM saying, okay, you got me.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:31:39] Ramit: I&#8217;ve been following you for nine years. Today&#8217;s post finally convinced me to buy your book. Now, I appreciate that they just bought. I will teach you to be rich or money for couples. But I&#8217;ve also learned over time that there&#8217;s a deeper dynamic here. Deep down, they see our relationship as adversarial.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:31:59] Ramit: They feel their job is to resist me, and my job is to convince them to buy my book. They fundamentally misunderstand our relationship and even deeper, they think that buying a book equates to doing the work. It&#8217;s the same as someone who hires a coach or buys a ticket to a conference. If I can be really honest, buying a book or attending an event is just the first step.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:32:23] Ramit: The real work has not even begun yet. So with Christina and Aaron, I can&#8217;t fix this for them. In fact, no coach can because the problem isn&#8217;t the debt or the numbers. The problem is that they don&#8217;t trust themselves and they do not trust each other. So what would you do if you were in my position right now?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:32:43] Ramit: Well, we&#8217;re gonna find out my approach right after the break.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:32:50] Ramit: What are your roles with the family? Finances? Who takes the lead?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:32:54] Kristina: We have an accountant now for the first time I take the lead on the account and stuff, just because my business is also included in that now.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:01] Ramit: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:01] Kristina: But on the day to day, we operate very separately.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:04] Ramit: How does it work? Like what kind of accounts do you have?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:06] Ramit: Anything joint?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:08] Kristina: No,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:09] Ramit: no joint accounts. Alright. Two kids, but no joint accounts.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:12] Kristina: I know.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:14] Ramit: Is there a reason for that? Or you just had your accounts and then you just slid in to the relationship and never really changed things?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:22] Kristina: Yep.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:22] Ramit: The second\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:23] Kristina: accurate.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:24] Ramit: Yeah. Do you currently track any spending at all? It&#8217;s okay if the answer&#8217;s no.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:29] Ramit: Most people don&#8217;t.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:30] Kristina: We do now. We do not just with the account. And that&#8217;s been helpful to sit down with them.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:35] Ramit: This is for your business.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:36] Kristina: For our business and our personal, we just got it. Um, this past year, it&#8217;s really helpful to see where everything&#8217;s going and just be in shock by it.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:45] Ramit: Okay.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:46] Erin: And he&#8217;s great and I love it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:47] Erin: And it, like I said, it&#8217;s been good to see everything on paper, but I feel like as we go, we&#8217;re kind of looking at it after it&#8217;s spent right now. Um, and I think what we need is the plan for the month instead of just looking at it and being like, oh, where&#8217;d that go? Or it&#8217;s gone.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:01] Ramit: Okay.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:01] Erin: What&#8217;s the plan?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:02] Ramit: What is this accountant&#8217;s name like Walter or something?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:04] Ramit: I can just imagine him, what&#8217;s his name?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:06] Kristina: Taryn Pre.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:08] Ramit: He&#8217;s Indian. He&#8217;s Punjabi Re my man. He&#8217;s great. Okay, cool. Alright. Listen, accountants are great. I like, I I&#8217;m seriously, I have great things to say about accountants, but they are not meant to track day-to-day spending. That&#8217;s not their purpose. They&#8217;re there for taxes.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:25] Ramit: They&#8217;re there for kind of like one time things or larger, once a year decisions that their purpose is not tracking where your guilt-free spending is going. So it&#8217;s great you have an accountant for your business. I think that&#8217;s great. That accountant can also work on your personal tax returns. Fantastic.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:45] Ramit: But you got, you gotta reset your expectations. They&#8217;re not gonna fix knowing where your money is going. You are.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:53] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:54] Ramit: Christina, um, I wanna know how you grew up with money. What were some of the phrases you remember your family saying about money when you were younger?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:01] Kristina: So there was a period of time when we didn&#8217;t have.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:05] Kristina: Much money at all. And then as my parents advanced in their career, there was a period of time where they got to that kind of middle class. Um, but money was never discussed. It was, you don&#8217;t talk about money. But then at the same time, it was very much like, do what you love and money will come. And\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:23] Ramit: they told you that?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:24] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:25] Ramit: Usually you don&#8217;t hear that from people who do not have a lot of money. Why do you think that? They said that\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:30] Kristina: I think they wanted better for us\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:33] Ramit: Uhhuh. When my Indian parents or my Chinese friends&#8217; parents want better, they&#8217;re like, get your ass to work. I&#8217;m putting you to work in a restaurant at age six.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:42] Ramit: And then, but your parents were like, find your passion. Can you explain this to me? Blow my mind.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:48] Kristina: I was, I was a kid with very big, uh, feelings and uh, I had a lot of, I had a lot of struggles with mental health.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:56] Ramit: Uh,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:56] Kristina: and I think my parents knew that no one was gonna be harder on me than me.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:36:02] Ramit: Okay.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:36:02] Kristina: And probably that had some impact on it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:36:05] Ramit: How would you describe their reaction? Did they encourage you more? Did they walk on eggshells around you? How would you describe their approach with you?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:36:15] Kristina: They just kinda let me be the intense kid that I was. Mm-hmm. They like, I wanted to be a lawyer, uh, like 13 &#8217;cause you got to wear a power suit. And I could work on Bay Street, like I was a little loser.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:36:31] Kristina: Mm-hmm. So I, and they just kind of were like, let her be. But at the same time, in, in school, I was very, like, I struggled intellectually. Like I was, I was incredibly shy and anxious. I had a speech impediment. I was kind of labeled like a dumb kid. So, um, I think they just kind of, there was probably that too, like walking on eggshells of.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:36:56] Kristina: You know, we don&#8217;t wanna be too hard on her.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:36:59] Ramit: You mentioned your mental health struggles and some of the speech impediment challenges. Were you able to, uh, get help for those as time went on?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:37:08] Kristina: Yeah, I am. I have extreme privilege living in Canada, so I had a psychiatrist since I was 12 years old.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:37:16] Ramit: Wow.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:37:16] Kristina: And I&#8217;ve had access to medication, access to care as I needed it over the years.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:37:21] Kristina: So I&#8217;m incredibly privileged. Awesome,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:37:24] Ramit: awesome. I&#8217;m really happy to hear that. That&#8217;s amazing. In your discussions with the folks in your treatment team, did you ever bring up money with them? Like, I find it challenging to engage with money.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:37:37] Kristina: No.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:37:39] Ramit: Hmm. What if you did?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:37:41] Kristina: I can&#8217;t imagine them seeing a space for it in the conversation.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:37:46] Ramit: Like you didn&#8217;t you mention something about the difficulty with numbers?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:37:50] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:37:52] Ramit: Seems to me there could be a conversation around that.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:37:55] Kristina: Thought about it. Hmm. Um, but no, we never, okay. We&#8217;ve never discussed it.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:38:01] Ramit: What do you think are the key lessons that you learned about money from your parents, your family?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:38:08] Kristina: I learned that it wasn&#8217;t always gonna be there.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:38:11] Ramit: Uhhuh,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:38:12] Kristina: if you work really hard though, really, really hard, you could get it. You can access it. It was, it was scarce. Things cost, money. Things are expensive. You have to be careful with things.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:38:26] Ramit: And what relationship do you see between those messages and what you bring to this relationship with money?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:38:33] Kristina: I mean, it&#8217;s very similar.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:38:35] Kristina: You can work hard and you can access it, but it doesn&#8217;t mean it&#8217;s gonna stay.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:38:39] Ramit: Right.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:38:39] Kristina: And you know, everything has a price and you have to be careful about how you spend your money and where you spend that money.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:38:49] Ramit: Christina was labeled the dumb kid growing up. She had a speech impediment. She struggled with numbers in school, and now she&#8217;s completely convinced that numbers are just too hard for her and therefore she can&#8217;t handle money.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:39:03] Ramit: When I was a kid in seventh grade, I switched from an elementary school where I was probably the top student to join a group of kids in middle school who were way, way more academically equipped than I was. Suddenly I realized I could not compete with them no matter how hard I tried. I was the worst kid in my math class, and I spent a lot of time on math.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:39:28] Ramit: I still just could not compete with their intellectual horsepower, and over time I found this to be true in certain other areas of life. Computer science, navigation, and directions. Even packing my suitcase, I think they&#8217;re all related, and no matter how hard I try, maybe I could be average, but the people who I&#8217;ve met over time, especially at places like Stanford.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:39:50] Ramit: Some of them were just simply naturally more gifted than me. Now, I think this is a very, very powerful, pivotal moment. I think that most of us don&#8217;t experience what it&#8217;s like to be around true excellence and see that some people just naturally are skilled in certain things. But I also think that when you do have the rare opportunity to encounter that, you can tell yourself one story or another.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:40:17] Ramit: One story is, I am not good at this. I can never be good at this. I&#8217;m going to give up on it. I hate that story, but I understand it. Sometimes it just feels really hard. That&#8217;s a lot of kids in America when it comes to math. The other story is, Hey, I am never going to be great at this, but first, let me put in the time to make sure that I&#8217;m actually trying.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:40:43] Ramit: This is hard for me. I&#8217;m not naturally gifted to this. I have to work twice or three times as hard as everybody else. At least let me build up some basic capabilities, and then I will find ways of working around it. To this day, I am not great at calculus. I am bad at computer science, but I found ways of handling it, of making up for my weaknesses, and then focusing on my strengths.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:41:06] Ramit: Talking to Christina. She&#8217;s obviously smart. She&#8217;s very self-aware. She acknowledged their negative storytelling in the first 10 minutes of our conversation. She&#8217;s very articulate. The problem is not that she&#8217;s not smart enough. The problem is that she has believed she&#8217;s not smart enough in this specific thing for so long that she&#8217;s simply given up on it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:41:26] Ramit: And here&#8217;s what&#8217;s wild. She learned as a kid that money was scarce. It wouldn&#8217;t always be there. So what did she do as an adult? She becomes an entrepreneur with wildly inconsistent income. Then she borrows $50,000 to invest in NFTs. She&#8217;s literally recreating the money lessons from her childhood, but she doesn&#8217;t realize it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:41:46] Ramit: Let&#8217;s keep going. What else did you, uh, learn, Aaron, from your family growing up about money?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:41:52] Erin: Not a whole lot. Um, the oldest of five kids, um, my dad had a very good job for quite a long time. So my mom was home, um, for the first 16 years with us. Uh, I would say like, I think my parents are quite good with money, but there&#8217;s no conversation around money.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:42:10] Erin: Um, it was something kind that you didn&#8217;t talk about. Um, at 16 my dad had a nervous breakdown and my mom went back into the workforce, um, at a very different pay grade, very different level. She&#8217;d been out for 16 years, um, and he did not end up going back to work following that. So we kind of had the experience of, you know, having some names after my dad working hard for a while to how are we going to do things And I know that they used all, any college university funds they used, um, just to make sure we were gonna be good.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:42:45] Ramit: Can I ask a little bit more about what happened with your dad?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:42:49] Erin: Um, yeah, he&#8217;s bipolar.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:42:51] Ramit: Got it. Okay. That&#8217;s gotta be difficult at that age for you?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:42:57] Erin: Um, yeah, I think it was &#8217;cause it, I, I think it was just like scary and unknown, but we weren&#8217;t very good at talking about it as a family, I would argue we were still not good at that stuff.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:09] Erin: So I think this, like, we don&#8217;t talk about it or know how,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:13] Ramit: yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:14] Erin: It started a long time ago.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:17] Ramit: Is there any cultural component to your family not talking about it or religious component?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:22] Erin: Not that I, not that I know of, but I\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:24] Kristina: I mean, you&#8217;re raised staunch Catholic.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:27] Ramit: Oh\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:27] Erin: yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:27] Ramit: Say no more.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:29] Erin: Yeah. Well there&#8217;s that.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:30] Ramit: Got that.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:31] Ramit: Hold on. Is it the same, uh, in Canada as the US got the Catholic guilt? Can we check that one off the box?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:38] Kristina: Yeah. Yeah. We were, we were both raised Catholic and,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:41] Erin: mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:41] Kristina: Being a homosexual being raised Catholic.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:44] Ramit: Yeah. Wait a second. Hey, we could have had this call in five minutes.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:48] Yeah,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:48] Ramit: you could have told me that.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:48] Ramit: I would&#8217;ve checked the box and said, here&#8217;s the problem, here&#8217;s the solution. See you later.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:51] Kristina: Yeah, yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:52] Ramit: Alright. Okay. Wow, that&#8217;s interesting.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:54] Kristina: I think we just feel guilt about everything. Like we don all. Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:58] Ramit: You feel guilt just normally and like\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:01] Kristina: all the time. All the time.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:02] Ramit: This is like, are we good enough parents?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:04] Ramit: Are we in touch with our family? Are we doing well enough at work? How about with each other and on and on and on. That kind of thing. Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:10] Kristina: Yeah, yeah. Exactly.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:11] Ramit: Alright. You both see a therapist?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:13] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:14] Ramit: Okay. Do you foresee a future where you operate on a daily basis without guilt?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:21] Erin: Oh, that would be nice. Can&#8217;t fathom what that looks like.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:26] Erin: Yeah. I don&#8217;t think I&#8217;ve ever thought about that.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:28] Ramit: Wow. Very interesting. You see. When we talk about money, a lot of people think they&#8217;re gonna come on here and we&#8217;re gonna talk about their freaking ratios of housing or some stuff like that. Nah, we&#8217;re talking about Catholic guilt today. Everybody. The, the reason that the rea, how do you think we wandered into this neighborhood?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:47] Ramit: I find it quite relevant. What do you both think?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:50] Kristina: How you&#8217;re raised deeply affects how you go about your day to day as adults.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:55] Ramit: Mm-hmm. Exactly. Mm-hmm. And this explains some, not all, but some of why it has been challenging for you both to tackle your relationship with money. The way that the story that you&#8217;ve told yourself is like, oh, we just don&#8217;t prioritize this.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:45:13] Ramit: And that&#8217;s probably true. You&#8217;ve told yourself the story that, you know, I, I&#8217;m not really good with numbers. It confuses me and it makes me feel ashamed. Probably also true, but it&#8217;s also probably incomplete. One way to think of it is like you&#8217;ve been wearing these. Uh, kind of like dirty glasses for a long time, trying to look through the world with all these smudges on them.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:45:36] Ramit: And you&#8217;re wondering like, why is everybody else able to do this? And we&#8217;re not like, are they all just smarter than us? Are we just stupid? Do we miss some day in school? It&#8217;s a terrible feeling when you feel like everyone else knows something and you don&#8217;t, that does not feel good.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:45:52] Erin: No,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:45:53] Ramit: there&#8217;s of course one other variable, which is your kids.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:45:56] Ramit: And I&#8217;m quite certain that you do not want to pass on the same guilt to your kids.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:01] Kristina: No.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:01] Ramit: Both shaking their heads.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:02] Kristina: I think we struggle with knowing, oh, what to say to our kids and what not to say to our kids about these things. &#8217;cause we&#8217;re worried we&#8217;re gonna them up, we&#8217;re worried we&#8217;re gonna make them feel shame about the cost of something or make them have a scarcity mindset.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:17] Kristina: Well,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:18] Ramit: do you both feel ashamed about money?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:20] Kristina: Yes.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:21] Ramit: Okay. Both, both nodding. Um, wait, so what&#8217;s your strategy to. Not have your kids feel shame about money. Let me guess. Don&#8217;t tell me. Let me guess. Let&#8217;s not talk about it at all at home because let kids be kids. Did I get that?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:38] Kristina: We some, yeah. Some of it like, yeah, I would say that&#8217;s more likely.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:44] Erin: We&#8217;ve talked about the desire to not do the wrong thing when it comes to them with it and like we just dunno what that is yet. So I think we are getting to the point where they&#8217;re getting older. We wanna understand how to make sure they have a positive relationship and we&#8217;d love to help &#8217;em with that.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:01] Erin: And we, part of this journey is we wanna first have a positive relationship and feel like we have that in our, our life as well to be able to showcase that and be an example of that.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:11] Ramit: Yeah, that&#8217;s great. You, you cannot teach kids a healthy relationship with money without having one yourself.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:16] Erin: Exactly. A hundred percent.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:19] Ramit: Both of them were raised Catholic. Both are gay. Both come from families that never talked about difficult things like money, mental health, and now they carry a lot of guilt. In fact, from my discussions with many, many people in my community, lots of Americans love to feel guilty about every major aspect of their life.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:39] Ramit: It is what many Americans grew up doing. It&#8217;s what they know. Sometimes I ask people who are overwhelmed with guilt, I ask them, if you took away the guilt, who would you be? A lot of &#8217;em do not have an answer. It&#8217;s too scary to think about taking something that is so core to their identity. Can I be really honest about guilt and money?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:48:01] Ramit: It&#8217;s gonna be very hard for you to fix money problems. It&#8217;s gonna be almost impossible to live a rich life when you are operating from a baseline of guilt and shame. I&#8217;ve talked to couples in their twenties, thirties, forties, fifties, sixties, seventies, from all kinds of different backgrounds, and I hear variations of the same answer.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:48:20] Ramit: It&#8217;s too complicated. I can&#8217;t do this. I&#8217;m just not good at money. Money makes me feel guilty. This podcast is not for your intellectual entertainment. This podcast is to show you that despite any number of fascinating human dynamics, you too can create a rich life. In fact, it is an obligation. It is your responsibility to engineer a rich life for you.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:48:48] Ramit: You can learn this. It doesn&#8217;t matter if you&#8217;re making a late start. Think about anything else that you&#8217;ve learned later in life. A sport, a language. You didn&#8217;t become elite but you didn&#8217;t need to. Money works the same way. You can go really far learning the basics, and you can get results fast. If you&#8217;re ready to understand the basics and work through the psychological barriers that have held you back, the same ones that I just talked about, my money coaching program will show you how you do not have to do this alone.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:49:19] Ramit: Join me at iwt.com\/money coaching and right after this we will get back to this conversation.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:49:30] Ramit: When you think about your financial situation right now, what part feels the hardest?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:49:36] Erin: Knowing what to do next and the fear of not wanting to, you know, fall into habits.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:49:43] Ramit: Okay. Christina?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:49:46] Kristina: I think for me it&#8217;s the maintaining of the income\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:49:51] Ramit: because money comes and money can go away. Is that what you mean?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:49:54] Kristina: Yeah.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:49:55] Kristina: Like when you talk, I keep being like, well, 210,000 is only based on the last two months and those have been my best months and blah, blah, blah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:50:06] Ramit: Yeah. Good, good. Identifying that invisible script. Um, Aaron, you&#8217;ve been described as the stable one when it comes to the finances. I think that&#8217;s because of your full-time job.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:50:18] Erin: Yes.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:50:19] Ramit: Do you accept that role?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:50:21] Erin: Not as I think willingly anymore. I think at first, very much so. Like I think, um, Christina is like one of the most amazing people I&#8217;ve ever met, and I really believe in her and I think I fell into this role not wanting to like, um, not encourage or not support. But then because of that, like I think over time when it went like longer, me being with table one, it just got really hard.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:50:50] Ramit: Is it hard now?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:50:53] Erin: I mean, it&#8217;s been easier lately because it, she&#8217;s crushing it.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:50:58] Ramit: Hold on, let&#8217;s repeat what just happened verbatim so you can see it.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:01] Erin: Okay.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:02] Ramit: You&#8217;re crying.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:03] Erin: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:04] Ramit: And I say, is it hard now? And your response was\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:09] Erin: No, because I don&#8217;t wanna say maybe I still sometimes yes.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:18] Ramit: Even in your hypothetical answer.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:19] Erin: Yeah. Mm-hmm. I\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:20] Ramit: read it. You said I Maybe I don&#8217;t want to say maybe. Yeah. Notice the qualifications, the equivocations.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:27] Erin: Oh yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:29] Ramit: Can I just tell you guys something? Sometimes feelings are not the most important thing in the room. Can we do an, can we do an exercise? We&#8217;ll call it REITs, 62nd truth telling. Okay.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:39] Ramit: In this exercise, all of us are gonna be respectful of each other. There&#8217;s no doubt about that. But we are going to say the thing that we have never been able to say that we really want our life partner to hear the thing that is so important. We are willing to potentially even hurt their feelings temporarily in order for us to build a stronger bond and a richer life together.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:52:07] Ramit: Let&#8217;s just take a second and think about what we might want our partner to hear. I.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:52:15] Erin: Want stability because I wanna have this great future together. And we talk about, I wanna feel more security. I want to enjoy, not stop working so hard all the time and actually enjoy. I feel like I miss her I the time because we&#8217;re so busy.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:52:35] Erin: I think that as proud as I am with the entrepreneurship piece, it&#8217;s just been just really hard. And I wish it wasn&#8217;t so hard.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:52:44] Kristina: Um, it&#8217;s funny, like you don&#8217;t say these things out loud, but you know, like we know, like, and I think in the past we&#8217;ve talked about like, I wouldn&#8217;t blame her if she resented me. I wouldn&#8217;t blame her if she were frustrated.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:53:03] Kristina: I don&#8217;t discount the pressure that it puts on her for me doing what I wanted to do. And quite frankly, like her not. Her job is not easy, and I know she can&#8217;t leave it, but I get to do what I wanna do. So I understand.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:53:23] Ramit: Christina, what about you? What do you, if you could be open and honest about money, knowing that Erin would be receptive and you would not be concerned with hurting her feelings or walking on eggshells, what would you say?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:53:34] Ramit: How do you feel about money? What do you want and what do you need?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:53:37] Kristina: I think I wanna feel more like a team. I wanna feel like I can tell you things, not like it&#8217;s not gonna hurt your feelings, but feel like that&#8217;s okay if it does. I think one thing I keep thinking about is we don&#8217;t take any shortcuts in our life.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:53:56] Kristina: Like we, we buy the best stuff. Parents always making like the most amazing meals or like everything is done to the end degree. And I think because of that, we like, we don&#8217;t get any time together and we don&#8217;t. Get to connect. And it feels like if there were more, if we were okay with taking some shortcuts, it would be easier to do that stuff.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:54:23] Ramit: So again, feelings are important. Here&#8217;s what I&#8217;m saying. I&#8217;m not trying to say you need to become a 10, you are who you are. But I will say that even in that experiment, I didn&#8217;t hear specifics. What, what changes are gonna happen. I don&#8217;t know. What do we need Christina to do? I don&#8217;t know. Christina, what do you need Aaron to do?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:54:40] Ramit: I don&#8217;t know. So it all felt very good.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:54:44] Erin: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:54:45] Ramit: But do y&#8217;all see how you&#8217;re trapped in this dynamic?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:54:48] Erin: Yeah. Yeah. Like you want specific action items, you mean, or\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:54:52] Ramit: you want specific action items? Not me. You should want them.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:54:56] Erin: Yeah. That&#8217;s what I mean. Like to hear from us. Yeah. I think like weird that we don&#8217;t know what we want.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:55:00] Ramit: Exactly. That&#8217;s really what it is. Does anybody know what? What do you want? Because making $210,000 a year, paying the minimum on your debt, saving no money, having two weeks of savings, to me, it&#8217;s just not acceptable.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:55:14] Erin: Mm-hmm. I wanna save $20,000 by January.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:55:24] Ramit: Really?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:55:26] Erin: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:55:26] Ramit: Don&#8217;t mind that it&#8217;s picked out of thin air.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:55:28] Ramit: I don&#8217;t care. At least we&#8217;re talking about a number and we can work with that.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:55:32] Erin: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:55:33] Ramit: But we can&#8217;t go from just feelings and talking magically to a number. Sometimes we just have to start with the math. Right now I&#8217;m gonna put it up on screen. If we look at your fixed costs, they are $10,000 a month. You see that?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:55:47] Erin: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:55:48] Ramit: So what you just described is, I want two months of emergency fund. Okay. Because if you got laid off mm-hmm. You would immediately cut all your spending on this stuff. Mm-hmm. You would cut your savings and your investments and all you need to do is just pay to keep the lights on. Just to overly simplify, so you just said, I want two months of an emergency fund.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:56:10] Ramit: I respect that Personally, I recommend people have six to 12 months. Okay. But I think two months is a great place to start. Do you see how what you just said actually fits in beautifully with your CSP? Outstanding. Yeah. Great work. Okay. Okay. Christina, what do you want?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:56:28] Kristina: I wanna tackle our debt. I feel like it&#8217;s crushing us each month.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:56:33] Kristina: I feel like we just give, we burn $1,200 every single month, just holding it\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:56:40] Ramit: Nice. You wanna pay your debt off?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:56:43] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:56:44] Ramit: Like, you wanna pay it off slowly, aggressively.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:56:48] Kristina: No, I wanna, I want it gone.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:56:50] Ramit: Really\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:56:51] Kristina: wanna get rid of it.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:56:53] Ramit: Wow. That&#8217;s, that&#8217;s cool. You know, we could do this. We could all make all of these things happen.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:56:59] Ramit: What do you think? Does anybody believe me? Sounds like, is this a silent skepticism I&#8217;m seeing right\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:57:05] Kristina: now? You&#8217;re, you&#8217;re weirdly confident, so let&#8217;s, yeah, I&#8217;m here for it.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:57:08] Ramit: Hey, of course I&#8217;m confident I know what I&#8217;m doing. The thing is, I want you to be confident, not me.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:57:14] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:57:14] Ramit: Alright. Here&#8217;s the deal. You wanna save money?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:57:16] Ramit: We can build up your savings. If I were you, that would make me feel so much more confident. Mm-hmm. That would make me feel safer. Aaron, which is something you have mentioned wanting. I would love that. Okay. Christina, if I were you, I would want to pay off this debt. Just get rid of it. Why are we even in this situation, we&#8217;re making way more money than I thought.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:57:40] Ramit: I want this done so I can be free of it.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:57:43] Erin: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:57:45] Ramit: I&#8217;m gonna pull the conscious spending plan up on screen. I would like you both to just look at these numbers. If something is confusing, just ask. I&#8217;m happy to walk through anything and just what I&#8217;m looking for is conceptually what are the two or three major things that you would do in order to build up your savings and or pay off your debt faster?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:58:10] Ramit: Let&#8217;s go through the key parts of this. We have your income over here, $210,000 a year. We have your fixed cost, that&#8217;s 79%. That&#8217;s pretty high. That will make it difficult for saving and investing a bunch of money. We have savings and investments at 1%, pretty low and guilt-free spending at 19% conceptually.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:58:33] Ramit: Aaron, what might you do?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:58:36] Erin: Actually put a plan to the guilt free spending money, like actually consciously say, okay. An amount of that is going to go towards savings, investments, paid on debt, something like that.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:58:49] Ramit: Great. Okay. So you would take some of that money, that $2,465 in guilt free spending and you would reallocate it towards savings and debt.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:58:58] Ramit: Mm-hmm. Great. Okay. I think that&#8217;s a very good strategy. Uh, Christina, what about you Conceptually,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:59:03] Kristina: Erin has some stocks, and we talked about cashing out a percentage of the stocks to be able to pay off the debts.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:59:15] Ramit: We&#8217;re not gonna do that. That&#8217;s, I&#8217;m gonna tell you why we&#8217;re not gonna do that. There&#8217;s like several reasons why we&#8217;re not gonna do that.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:59:19] Ramit: Number one, if you sell your stock, um, where does the money go for in your investments? It goes to your debt. So what&#8217;s gonna happen as you two get older? You&#8217;re gonna have no money. You&#8217;re basically robbing your future self and gotten really nothing out of it. It&#8217;s not a good situation. So gimme another conceptual choice you&#8217;re gonna make.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:59:40] Kristina: I don&#8217;t cut up my credit card. Um, I don&#8217;t even want it. I&#8217;ve started using debit for everything. Mm-hmm. For a while I used credit for everything because I got points.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:59:55] Ramit: You used a credit, you used a credit card because you got points when you&#8217;re in credit card debt.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:00:00] Kristina: Yeah, because at first it was like, well, I get points and then I&#8217;ll pay it off.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:00:06] Kristina: Just being honest, it just is what went through my head<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:00:12] Ramit: one day in my obituary. I want to be celebrated not for the millions of people I helped to lead rich lives, not for being a loving husband and son and brother, none, none of that. All I want to be celebrated for is for remaining sane. As I talk to person after person in severe credit card debt who still charges so they get free miles and points.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:00:43] Ramit: Why am I on this planet? Okay. I had to stop myself from exploding right there. Christina just told me she&#8217;s still using her credit cards. Why Four points? And that is while carrying $50,000 in credit card debt, I&#8217;m sitting here thinking, are you serious? You&#8217;re paying over 20% in interest so you can earn 1% back in points.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:01:08] Ramit: You know, the first time this happened on this show, I thought it was a one-off. Then I met guest after guest who&#8217;s in credit card debt, but they keep spending on their card and when I ask &#8217;em why, they look at me like I&#8217;m crazy. Uh, duh. For the points, you remember how happy we were when we were kids. We opened up a happy meal and we got a toy at the bottom.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:01:27] Ramit: That&#8217;s essentially what a lot of people do with their credit card points. They spend $50 to get 25 cents in free toys. Let me tell you, as someone who has points and who has money, the very best rewards program is being able to pay for whatever you want, whenever you want. And if you are in debt, listen closely.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:01:46] Ramit: Credit card rewards should be the last thing that you are focused on. So what else can you do?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:01:53] Kristina: Make more money.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:01:54] Ramit: You could how?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:01:57] Kristina: Keep doing what I&#8217;ve been doing.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:01:59] Ramit: Okay. I agree. And hopefully that&#8217;s great. What if it&#8217;s not, &#8217;cause you mentioned the last two months have been your best months ever.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:04] Kristina: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:05] Ramit: What if it goes down,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:07] Kristina: that plan doesn&#8217;t work,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:08] Ramit: and then\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:09] Kristina: we, we need another plan.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:12] Ramit: No, we&#8217;re not. Not even close. You two make $210,000. What the hell are you talking about? We&#8217;re you make 85, 60 a month. Right? That&#8217;s you.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:20] Kristina: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:21] Ramit: Meaning in the last two months, if we extend that out for 12 months, you&#8217;re getting paid $102,000 per year.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:28] Kristina: Mm-hmm. Right?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:29] Ramit: Mm-hmm. How much could you make if you got a job on the open market?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:32] Ramit: I\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:33] Kristina: don&#8217;t know. Buck 50 maybe.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:36] Ramit: Oh, what the fuck? You can make 150 K if you got a full-time job.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:40] Kristina: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:41] Ramit: Just outta curiosity. Wait a minute. I&#8217;m kidding. Am I being led into a trap or am I the one leading the trap? &#8217;cause usually I&#8217;m leading the trap. I&#8217;m not sure what&#8217;s happening right now, but I&#8217;m gonna go with it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:52] Ramit: Tell me, before these last couple of excellent performing months in your business where you&#8217;ve made 85, 60 per month gross, how much were you making before that?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:01] Kristina: Like 5K, probably\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:03] Ramit: 5K per month, meaning 60 K per year. Mm-hmm. And you&#8217;re telling me you can make 150 K on the open market?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:09] Kristina: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:10] Ramit: And this has been happening for a long time.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:11] Ramit: Out of curiosity, just asking an innocent question. Why not shut the business down? Go make $150,000 a year.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:17] Kristina: It&#8217;s my nightmare. We&#8217;re working in corporate. I just don&#8217;t function well.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:24] Ramit: You don&#8217;t like\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:24] Kristina: corporate there at all? I hate it.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:26] Ramit: All right. I don&#8217;t, one thing I don&#8217;t like about corporate is, um, wearing those key cards, you know, on your wallet, you, or on your, you gotta pull that out and badge in.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:35] Ramit: I&#8217;m like you, I&#8217;m not wearing anything, just &#8217;cause my boss told me to. That&#8217;s why I&#8217;m not set for corporate. But you know what I hate more than wearing a key card is being in $106,000 of debt. Now, I&#8217;m not saying you have to go back to a corporate job. I&#8217;m not saying it&#8217;s your life, your money.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:53] Erin: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:53] Ramit: I am saying this is a market difference in how much you can make.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:58] Ramit: If you can make 150 K on the open market, that is certainly one possible way to rapidly pay your debt off. Would you agree? Mm-hmm. Okay, great. Now we&#8217;re getting stuff out on the table right now. Let&#8217;s just come up with some general guidelines. Where do you think the $2,400 a month is going?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:17] Erin: Eating out?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:18] Ramit: How much Wow.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:21] Ramit: A look of alarm on Christina&#8217;s face. How much.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:25] Erin: Like four or five maybe. Probably at least five, probably.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:31] Ramit: Um, have you guys ever listened to this podcast before? Whatever People tell me it&#8217;s three times the actual\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:36] Erin: as much. Excellent. Yeah. Great.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:38] Ramit: Especially for people who like good food as you both described.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:42] Ramit: So if you say 500, Hmm. Yeah. Right. It&#8217;s a thousand at least. Okay. Alright. What&#8217;s next?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:49] Kristina: Coffee.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:50] Ramit: That&#8217;s already included in eating out.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:53] Kristina: Okay. Oh, then yes, for sure. It&#8217;s at\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:55] Ramit: 1,015 hundred, right? Yeah. Okay. What else? The house. How much stuff is coming onto this house? Better be honest too, &#8217;cause I know we&#8217;re counting Christmas in there and whatever, holidays, all of it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:06] Kristina: Like birthdays and Christmas.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:08] Erin: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:10] Kristina: Aaron loves a celebration, like the rest of\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:12] Erin: it, I guess. Like the rest,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:13] Ramit: the rest of it. Okay.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:15] Kristina: Like, yeah, I,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:17] Ramit: oh, it&#8217;s a lot.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:18] Kristina: It&#8217;s a lot.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:19] Ramit: It&#8217;s a lot. Okay. Alright.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:20] Kristina: Yeah,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:21] Ramit: I, I like, I like the honesty. Honestly. This is really helpful. There&#8217;s definitely some other stuff in here that&#8217;s not being counted.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:26] Ramit: Like if you travel once a year. Mm-hmm. And let&#8217;s just say that it costs $12,000 for a trip. We spread all that out. That&#8217;s actually $1,000 per month. So I&#8217;m being super approximate here. Mm-hmm. But if we just factor the following in, eating out 1500 a month, who knows if I&#8217;m right or wrong? I&#8217;m probably wrong.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:45] Ramit: I don&#8217;t know in what direction, but let&#8217;s just say Uber&#8217;s 300. House 600. Okay. What do you notice about all these things?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:53] Erin: It&#8217;s a\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:53] Kristina: lot of money.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:54] Ramit: Yes. What was your rich life vision again? Aaron? What was yours?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:58] Erin: You mean like stability and being able to do what we want when we want?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:00] Ramit: Yeah. Stability. Well, no, you&#8217;re not gonna do what you want when you want.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:03] Ramit: You&#8217;re gonna get stability first. That comes first. Like let&#8217;s say it was six months of savings. And then Christina, what was your vision?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:11] Kristina: Paying off the debt.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:12] Ramit: What do you notice about these expenses in light of each of your visions?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:17] Kristina: They would really contribute to them.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:20] Ramit: Yeah. And actually every time you spend a dollar on these, they&#8217;re actually leading you further away from your vision.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:25] Kristina: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:26] Ramit: Like every coffee you buy is actually one step further away from the rich life that you yourself described. Every Uber trip you take, you&#8217;re going to Tim Horton&#8217;s. No, you&#8217;re not going to Tim Horton&#8217;s. No, you&#8217;re going to hell. It&#8217;s\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:40] Kristina: definitely\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:40] Ramit: not. You&#8217;re gonna hell because you&#8217;re going further away from your rich life.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:44] Kristina: Yes. That makes sense.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:45] Ramit: Alright. Um, here&#8217;s what I see, 2,400 bucks a month at least. That could be, at least in part, taking you closer to paying off debt and building up savings. I don&#8217;t mind. If you want to eat out, that&#8217;s gonna happen, but I think there&#8217;s probably just a lot of unconscious money going towards random that feels good.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:07:07] Ramit: Mm-hmm. But at the same time, you&#8217;re not feeling good. You&#8217;re not living your rich life. You&#8217;re actually out of alignment.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:07:12] Kristina: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:07:13] Ramit: What would you like to do?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:07:14] Kristina: I wanna get the 19% down to, I don&#8217;t know, like 7%.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:07:22] Ramit: What do you wanna do with that money?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:07:23] Kristina: So like half of that go towards savings and then half of it go towards paying off the debt.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:07:29] Ramit: I like that. That&#8217;s a very reasonable assumption. I also especially like that you said 7%. That&#8217;s picking a number. Who knows if it&#8217;s right or wrong, but we are operating with numbers here. Let&#8217;s see how it looks. What I&#8217;m gonna do is I&#8217;m gonna go up to debt, and right now you&#8217;re paying 800 and 400, so you&#8217;ll see it&#8217;s still 19%.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:07:46] Ramit: Nothing has changed. You&#8217;re currently paying $1,200 a month towards debt. You can see that I&#8217;m gonna add, hmm, an extra 200 bucks towards debt. You&#8217;re only at 18%. So you can see that, wow, we can afford to do a lot more. Let&#8217;s do a thousand extra dollars towards debt. Oh my gosh, you&#8217;re at 11%. That&#8217;s still $1,465 a month.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:08:10] Ramit: Let&#8217;s put a little bit towards savings. I don&#8217;t know. 500. Okay, you&#8217;re down to 8%. Can I make an observation? Mm-hmm. Do you all really want to give $150 a month for gifts instead of gifting yourself that $150 and put it in your savings?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:08:26] Erin: No.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:08:27] Ramit: Christina&#8217;s like, no. No. Aaron,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:08:29] Erin: I, it&#8217;s funny, like, I feel like immediately like selfish that I would put it towards like, like us versus like celebrating our friends and family.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:08:39] Erin: I don&#8217;t know. I know that that might sound silly.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:08:42] Ramit: I have this example where I tell people sometimes you have to imagine what somebody else would do, somebody who&#8217;s really good with money and like you may have an old boss. Um, sometimes when I&#8217;m thinking of a management problem, I think about Captain Jean-Luc Picard from Star Trek, right?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:09:01] Ramit: Good leader. And so you could pick anybody, dead, alive, actor, whatever. You all need to pick me. For what you would do when it comes to some of the, because sometimes I think your picker is way off. Like what would Ramit say to do? Ramit say, would say he would take this mother. We&#8217;re not paying them, we&#8217;re paying us.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:09:19] Ramit: We come first as a family unit, us two, and our two kids. That&#8217;s it. There&#8217;s no selfishness involved. We are putting ourselves first. We are paying ourselves first. Literally. Now you&#8217;re putting 5% towards savings. Not bad, not bad. But do you see that? What had to happen there in order for that to work, the spreadsheet doesn&#8217;t matter.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:09:42] Ramit: It&#8217;s about you becoming emotionally congruent with what your rich life is. You actually have to believe it. You actually have to live it. And if somebody comes up to you, Hey, why don&#8217;t you give me that Christmas gift? You always give me that Christmas. You say, I love you. I wanna spend time with you right now.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:09:57] Ramit: It&#8217;s important for us to focus on building our savings, and the two of you have to be aligned. Partners because you cannot get where you wanna go if one of you is out of alignment. What do you think, Aaron?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:10:10] Erin: Yes. That you can&#8217;t. We can&#8217;t without being aligned. I agree. We&#8217;re not gonna get anywhere, so we need to be a team.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:10:18] Ramit: I left 25 bucks a month for gifts. Are you willing to go from one 50 to 25?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:10:23] Erin: Sure. Will it be easy? I&#8217;m not saying it will be, but am I willing to do it? Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:10:28] Ramit: Great. That&#8217;s it. I love that energy.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:10:30] Erin: Like it&#8217;s gonna be tough. Yes. But like\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:10:33] Ramit: yes.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:10:33] Erin: You&#8217;re gonna have to figure it out, right? Like\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:10:35] Ramit: all of this is going to be hard.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:10:37] Ramit: All of\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:10:37] Erin: it. Yeah, for sure.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:10:38] Ramit: And it&#8217;s important for you both to recognize that all the easy decisions happened five years ago. The easy decisions were ringing up the credit card and taking the line of credit. All that was easy. Now you are only left with hard choices, in my opinion. You either do the hard stuff yourself or the world is gonna force you to do it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:10:57] Ramit: So why don&#8217;t we just fix it now? What do you say? Yeah. Alright. My team ran some quick calculations. For your credit card debt. We assumed 20% a PR because of Canada. At a thousand dollars a month, it would take you nine years to pay it off and you would pay almost $60,000 in interest. At $2,000 a month.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:11:23] Ramit: That will take less than three years and you&#8217;ll pay just $15,200 in interest. What do you notice about that difference?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:11:35] Erin: It&#8217;s pretty big.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:11:36] Ramit: It&#8217;s huge. It&#8217;s, that&#8217;s from 1000 to $2,000.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:11:40] Erin: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:11:40] Ramit: Now, just to put it in context, if you two are making $210,000, we&#8217;re talking about the difference between 1000 and $2,000 per month.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:11:50] Ramit: Mm-hmm. What do you notice? It should be doable.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:11:53] Kristina: Not that much. Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:11:54] Ramit: Yeah. Why does it feel so hard when you have tried in the past?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:11:59] Kristina: I think probably &#8217;cause we don&#8217;t have numbers attached to it.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:12:01] Ramit: Exactly. Exactly. It&#8217;s all like, it&#8217;s all feelings that have calcified. It&#8217;s like strong. I feel very strongly about this, but like, alright, that&#8217;s fine, but like, what are the numbers?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:12:13] Ramit: There&#8217;s no numbers.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:12:14] Kristina: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:12:14] Ramit: Mm-hmm. And in fact, what&#8217;s happened is you&#8217;ve created an identity around things like, you know, I love, um, good food and like, um, decorating the house and giving gifts. Those have become part of your identity and that&#8217;s actually what makes this really hard. This idea that like, I might have to actually change who I am.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:12:34] Ramit: I&#8217;m no longer the good gift giver. This actually really hard, but it can be done. Can we just look at your fixed costs really quick? Is there a way we can get those down? Your, oh, your fixed costs are 86%. That&#8217;s be artificially high because you&#8217;ve decided to pay more off. Oh, okay. Don&#8217;t freak out.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:12:55] Erin: What happened?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:12:57] Ramit: I mean, look at this. In fact, if we look at it. $2,200 a month towards your debt payments. If you can stick with it, that will go away relatively quickly. Can we look at the rest of this?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:13:11] Kristina: Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:13:11] Ramit: Mm-hmm. Um, your rent, your rent is gonna go up for less, is that correct?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:13:15] Kristina: We don&#8217;t wanna spend any more than what we&#8217;re spending right now.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:13:19] Ramit: Great. Agreed. So how are you gonna do it?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:13:22] Kristina: We have to accept less.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:13:26] Ramit: Yes. You mentioned you have how many bedrooms? Three, two and a half.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:13:30] Kristina: Yeah.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:13:31] Ramit: Might have to go down. Would you be willing to do that?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:13:33] Kristina: Yeah, I would. For this?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:13:37] Ramit: Yes. That&#8217;s the way you do it. Trust me. There&#8217;s a light at the end of this tunnel. You start making these changes, number one you&#8217;re gonna discover they&#8217;re easier to do, they&#8217;re compounding.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:13:46] Ramit: You make one change, you go, oh, like we&#8217;re actually okay with a half less bedroom. We&#8217;re fine with that. Oh my God, we&#8217;re okay spending less eating out. We just plan a little bit more. We make our coffee at home, we&#8217;re okay with it. The other thing is you&#8217;re sending a message to yourself. I&#8217;m the kind of person that sets a goal and follows through with money, just like the both of you do at work.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:14:04] Ramit: It compounds. Alright, what else? Can we cut on this? Groceries?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:14:09] Erin: I&#8217;m sure. Yeah. How much like having an actual plan? Seven.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:14:13] Ramit: Seven. Can you do it? You tell me.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:14:15] Erin: I don&#8217;t know.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:14:16] Ramit: Alright. I, I say 800, target that. Okay. And like if it&#8217;s eight 15, don&#8217;t beat yourself up.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:14:24] Erin: Okay.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:14:25] Ramit: Let me guess. Right now when you shop, you don&#8217;t shop to the price, you don&#8217;t shop at the labels or anything, right?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:14:29] Ramit: You just get what you want?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:14:30] Erin: Uh, yeah. Mostly for like a recipe or plan or like that kind of a plan. But I don&#8217;t do it from like a spending plan. Like I think it&#8217;s not lining up obviously.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:14:40] Ramit: Exactly. So from now on you&#8217;re gonna have to shop differently again. It&#8217;s gonna suck for a couple of weeks and then you&#8217;re gonna quickly discover probably, uh, I can&#8217;t make this type of dish that I used to make.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:14:49] Ramit: So sorry, from now on it&#8217;s gonna be a little bit simpler. But you could do it. I know you can do it. Alright. 200 bucks actually is really powerful and I wanna show you something because I&#8217;m not just gonna let that $200 just get evaporated into your financial system. You just saved 200 bucks. Hard decisions at the grocery store.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:15:07] Ramit: Where do you wanna put that? 200 bucks.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:15:09] Erin: Either savings or debt. I don&#8217;t know what the right answer is here.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:15:11] Ramit: Let&#8217;s split.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:15:11] Erin: Don&#8217;t know which one.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:15:13] Ramit: Split it. Let&#8217;s split it. Okay. I mean, mathematically it&#8217;s probably a better idea to put it towards the debt &#8217;cause it&#8217;s so high interest. Yeah, but I don&#8217;t mind. We can do both.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:15:21] Ramit: Emergency fund becomes 2 25.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:15:24] Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:15:24] Ramit: That&#8217;s nice. That&#8217;s 6% savings. And then we&#8217;ll go over to the debt payments and we&#8217;ll make this 1300. Holy. This is really starting to add up here. You&#8217;re gonna have money automatically flowing into savings. You are literally going to have an automatic payment of $725 going into an emergency fund.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:15:42] Ramit: You will never have to think about it. But after three or so months, you&#8217;re gonna see thousands of dollars just growing in there. And you&#8217;re gonna be like, what the fuck? This is so easy. Why didn&#8217;t we do this? &#8217;cause you didn&#8217;t have a system. The area you are most likely to fail is guilt-free spending at $965 per month.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:16:02] Erin: Right.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:16:03] Ramit: You two are gonna have to make a very clear plan on what you wanna spend that money on. Okay. Because that&#8217;s everything that&#8217;s eating out. That&#8217;s coffee, that&#8217;s travel, that&#8217;s all of it.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:16:16] Kristina: How do you do that? Like how do you, how do you, how do you do that?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:16:20] Ramit: Great question. How do you think\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:16:22] Kristina: we gotta get clear on where we&#8217;re currently spending it and then probably set a budget based on item, like break it down even further.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:16:34] Ramit: I think that&#8217;s conceptually right. Usually there are a couple of categories that people need to track. One of them is eating out of $965. How much do you want to go towards eating out?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:16:47] Kristina: Realistically, like it would\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:16:48] Erin: probably be half.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:16:49] Ramit: Okay, fair enough. I don&#8217;t\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:16:51] Erin: know.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:16:52] Ramit: 500 bucks approximately. Erin, what do you say?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:16:54] Erin: The best way for us to not fail at this is to realistically go like, okay, let&#8217;s start with half while we&#8217;re trying to figure out where we&#8217;re at and then challenge ourselves to get it down. But I feel like if we&#8217;re gonna be super unrealistic and be like, oh, well we could do this. That&#8217;s where we&#8217;re gonna be like, yeah, maybe like hard fail.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:17:10] Erin: So I think\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:17:11] Ramit: Agreed. Yes. Your instinct is right on. Yeah. So if it&#8217;s 500 bucks, perfect, then the two of you need to decide that, and then you actually need to just like actually look at a month long calendar. And be like, Hey, let, because this is way tighter than we&#8217;re used to. We&#8217;re used to just going out whenever we want.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:17:27] Ramit: We just swipe. Mm-hmm. It doesn&#8217;t matter. But actually now we actually have to plan ahead. So let&#8217;s break it down. Um, right now, if each of us goes out to dinner twice and then we each get coffee three times a week, how much does that add up to remember to include tax tip? All of it. And then you&#8217;re gonna quickly realize, holy, we probably can&#8217;t afford to do delivery.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:17:47] Ramit: &#8217;cause that takes up like half of whatever. We can&#8217;t do coffee as much. You know what? I&#8217;d rather just make coffee at home, but we can do these two dinners, so let&#8217;s plan it every other Friday we&#8217;re gonna do a dinner. You do this one, I&#8217;ll do this one, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Each of you can own your number $250 per month.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:18:06] Ramit: That&#8217;s the way you do it for travel, if that&#8217;s one of your things. One of you will own the travel number, and so when it comes to your next trip, you&#8217;re in charge of making sure you are at the number or below it, et cetera. That&#8217;s the way I would approach it. How do you, how does that feel to you, Christina?<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:18:21] Kristina: It feels. Good. I think the, the one place my brain goes is like the, so do we get like a separate account to put those bits of money aside?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:18:33] Ramit: Very good question. So, you know, one simple way to start, so first of all, I want you to reread. I will teach to be rich together and read it, not the audio version. You can have the audio version to supplement it for sure.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:18:48] Ramit: But I want you to look through the diagrams and the way that I talk about tracking, and I actually want you to do it together. When you do that, especially in chapter four, conscious spending, you&#8217;re gonna see how to focus on the key levers. You&#8217;re also gonna get some more ideas of how to reduce some of your current expenses.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:19:05] Ramit: You can take that money, you can redirect it to savings. Now there is one last piece that I want to emphasize, which is the income piece. Christina, you&#8217;ve mentioned several times, like, I don&#8217;t know if it&#8217;s gonna stay. My income is good for the last two months, but it could all go away. Here&#8217;s what I tell every entrepreneur.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:19:26] Ramit: First of all, the fact that you&#8217;re making a run rate of $102,000 a year is outstanding. That&#8217;s awesome. But you know that Aaron craves stability. It&#8217;s a big deal. It, and the whole entrepreneurship, which until recently has made, you know, around 60 K per year. The whole idea of being involved in NFTs, all of it, is the opposite of stability.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:19:56] Ramit: And so right now you&#8217;re in an enviable position. It&#8217;s awesome. Here&#8217;s what I would suggest to you. I would suggest making an agreement with Erin, and I would suggest you take the lead, Christina, and you come with a, a suggested outcome. You say, look, I am going to commit that I&#8217;m going to make at least $8,000 per month.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:20:20] Ramit: At least $8,000 per month consistently on average for the next four months, five months, six months. And if by the end of six months my number is not there, I&#8217;m gonna quit and get a full-time job. And if it is off to the races, we&#8217;re great, et cetera. Now, again, I&#8217;m not telling you have to do this. It may not be six months.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:20:45] Ramit: There&#8217;s all kinds of variables you can play with, but you can see Aaron&#8217;s nodding, just this idea that do the entrepreneur thing, great. You&#8217;re crushing it right now, great. But if it goes away, if it doesn&#8217;t hit the numbers you need, there&#8217;s got to be a plan where you call it, you wrap it up, go get a well-paying job bank a bunch of money, and then when the time is right, you can come back and be an entrepreneur again.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:21:08] Ramit: How does that strike you, Christina?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:21:09] Kristina: Yeah, I think that&#8217;s fair.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:21:11] Erin: Yeah, I think that&#8217;s fair. As much as I&#8217;ve always wanted to just be like. No, do everything you want. Um, it just, I think it, I think it&#8217;s a realistic look at like having what, having a plan in that situation looks like. Yes. And I think that&#8217;s what I craved it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:21:27] Erin: Not even like just the stability. It&#8217;s like, what? What&#8217;s the plan B? And I think not having the plan B has been hard. So if we had a plan B for that, I think that would be great.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:21:36] Kristina: And I think some of what the hard part for you is that like not knowing if this is just gonna stay like this forever. Like not having a plan leaves you guessing.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:21:49] Ramit: Now let me ask you something, because it&#8217;s all great to talk about all these cool ways that we can do this, but if nothing changes in the next five years, what will happen?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:22:01] Kristina: I&#8217;ll probably be divorced. Yes. Yeah. Or yeah, just, yeah. We need to change.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:22:09] Ramit: Christina, why do you say that? It&#8217;s pretty serious?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:22:13] Kristina: Because I think that.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:22:15] Kristina: She would divorce me and she, and we&#8217;ve had to have like those hard conversations before. Mm-hmm.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:22:23] Ramit: Like this is not just an intellectual exercise. It&#8217;s actually like it has to work. Yeah. When you walk into something like this and you walk out of it saying like, this has to work and therefore we are going to make it work.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:22:37] Ramit: I don&#8217;t care if it&#8217;s hard, I don&#8217;t care if we have to have difficult conversations. I don&#8217;t care if I have to say things I&#8217;ve never said before, we are doing this because we as a couple, as parents need to make this work.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:22:50] Erin: Yeah. I, I, I do completely agree. Like, like we have no choice but to like, make hard choices and changes.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:22:58] Ramit: Christina and Erin have a plan now two and a half years to pay off $106,000 in debt. Cut guilt-free spending from 2,400 to $500 a month, no more using credit cards while carrying a balance. This is a clear, simple plan. I love it. Now, simple is good, but simple is not the same as easy. Here&#8217;s what I&#8217;ll say.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:23:19] Ramit: I was pleasantly surprised by how they both showed up today. They were coachable. They were open. They ran the numbers themselves and faced uncomfortable truths. They were even willing to hear something that&#8217;s really difficult, especially in America, which is that buying a house right now would actually make things worse.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:23:37] Ramit: They&#8217;ve worked with coaches before. I know that nothing stuck. Why? Maybe they were just performing. Maybe they were just going through the motions. The question of course is will it be different this time? I&#8217;m not sure, but I have hope based on what I saw today. It depends on them whether they are willing to do the ongoing work, not just the spreadsheets.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:23:58] Ramit: That part&#8217;s easy, but the work of building trust with themselves and with each other, having uncomfortable conversations week after week, which will get easier and will eventually feel good. Good news, we have follow-ups. Let&#8217;s check &#8217;em out and see if they&#8217;ve been able to do that work.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:24:17] Erin: Okay. Recapping my biggest surprise, biggest takeaway and what we plan to change from Christina and I having our chat with Ramit.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:24:26] Erin: Biggest surprise. I think for me, I think this is pretty mutual. Um, how terrible we are at having these conversations. Even though we&#8217;re very well-intentioned and we don&#8217;t wanna hurt each other&#8217;s feelings that is doing more harm than it is doing good. So figuring out that clear communication. I love Ramit&#8217;s suggestion of, you know, what are you dealing with the facts and what are you dealing with the, with the emotion.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:24:46] Erin: So there&#8217;s probably ways we can separate that, which I think is really, really great. But that I think was my biggest surprise, um, biggest takeaway that I wanna make it personally, I will make it, um, easier for Christina to talk to me about these things so that we do take a little bit, um, of that hesitation out of it and figuring that out.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:25:06] Erin: Also, just. Conscious, being conscious and having a conscious spending plan. I do love the title of that. I think the unconscious piece has been not so beneficial for us. So yeah, bringing that conscious spending plan together is gonna be great. Um, and then specific action items. Meeting once a week for sure is what we&#8217;re gonna do, um, to just kind of kick it off as well as really taking everything Ramit has said seriously and give it a go because we&#8217;ve got nothing to lose.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:25:33] Ramit: Hey folks. Uh, Christina here finishing my homework for Ramit. So the biggest surprise for me, I think was just how hard it was. Like the physical reaction that both of us had with telling each other how we were feeling about this. We knew avoidance was an issue, but I don&#8217;t think I realized how bad it was and how much our fear of hurting and disappointing one another was driving our behavior.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:25:56] Ramit: Some of the takeaways for me are really related to just like, this isn&#8217;t our. Our, the realm of possibility, this is something that we can do. This is something we&#8217;re in control of, and it&#8217;s not gonna be easy. I think Ramit said your easy time is over. You&#8217;ve had a very long time to say yes to everything, and it&#8217;s gonna be hard, but the changes in the shifts that you have to make aren&#8217;t as hard, I think as, as I thought.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:26:21] Ramit: And they&#8217;re, they feel manageable. Um, and the difference between like a $100 a month in one place and $200 a month is substantial. So the more that, almost like gamifies it for me, the, the saving in one area and saying, okay, cool, that means that the reallocation of money and the debt payments and the debt reduction is gonna come much more quickly.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:26:45] Ramit: Um, feels really good for me. The biggest changes we&#8217;re gonna make are we&#8217;re gonna be meeting weekly about this, uh, and seeing where the money&#8217;s going and making shifts and changes to the conscious spending plan, as well as just looking for a place we decided we&#8217;re not going to pay any more than what we&#8217;re already paying, even if it means we&#8217;re gonna get less.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:27:06] Ramit: And it&#8217;s just something that we&#8217;re willing to accept before the show. We could tell we were kind of creeping up, like, well, maybe 4,500 is fine, or maybe, you know, maybe even more than that. And that&#8217;s, both of us feel very uncomfortable by that now. So those are the updates from, uh, from my end,\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:27:24] Erin: latest updates since we last chatted.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:27:28] Erin: Is, um, I feel like a lesson that&#8217;s come up that we learned with Rami, Christina and I, is something we talk to our kids about all the time, which is that we can do hard things. We spend a lot of time trying to explain this to them and what that means. And I think we&#8217;ve recently made a decision to do the harder thing.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:27:49] Erin: We had to move really quickly. A time where throwing a lot of money at a situation like that to make it feel easier, do the thing that is more convenient, could be so easy. But we&#8217;re doing the thing that&#8217;s a bit harder. We are moving in with Christina&#8217;s parents. We are going to figure out the right thing, the thing that is going to be the right move for us financially.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:28:10] Erin: So I&#8217;m really proud of us for doing that. Next step will be to revise our conscious spending plan based on our new, um, you know, expenditures with our new living situation. And we will go from there and keep doing the, doing the work and doing the hard.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:28:26] Kristina: Hey y&#8217;all. The biggest update from our end is that I am doing this video from my new spot, my new setup at my parents&#8217; house.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:28:37] Kristina: So we were evicted from our rental. We talked about that on the podcast, and I think we just weren&#8217;t prepared after having the conversation to spend any more than we were already spending. We were kind of at the limit, and we have the privilege and are so incredibly grateful that my parents live 15 minutes down the road and have the room for us.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:28:59] Kristina: And they said, don&#8217;t rush. Find something that works for you. Don&#8217;t pay. More than you&#8217;re willing to spend. Come save some rent over the next few months and an indetermined amount of time and bring the kids and we&#8217;ll be here. Again, just so much privilege and, and gratitude in that. But, uh, the ego was fighting big time, a lot of resistance, uh, to the idea and a lot of pride in going back home to my parents.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:29:30] Kristina: But Aaron and I sat down. We made the call together, which is also a big update. We spoke about the things that made us uncomfortable, spoke about the things that we were worried about, and just said, let&#8217;s do it. What&#8217;s the worst that can happen? So we&#8217;re taking it in stride. We&#8217;re doing our best. We&#8217;re continuing to just try to talk together more and stop avoiding really hard conversations, and that&#8217;s the biggest thing.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:29:58] Kristina: So. Wish us love. We&#8217;ll talk to you soon. Bye.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:30:02] Ramit: Listen up if you want my help with your specific money questions. There are only two ways to get it. First, you can apply to be on this podcast at iwt.com\/apply. Or second, you can join my money coaching program instantly at iwt.com\/money Coaching. In that program, you get access to live virtual events, monthly group coaching calls, live q and as, and an amazing, huge community of other people like you.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"a-b-r-La\">\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:30:31] Ramit: Check it out at iwt.com\/money coaching.<\/span><\/p>\n<p>&nbsp;<\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>\ufeff\ufeff\ufeff \ufeff\ufeff Ramit Sethi of I Will Teach You To Be Rich talks to Kristina and Erin, a married couple who have been together for 10 years, raising two children in Toronto. They make good money, but they have no system for their finances, which has led to years of avoidance. They&#8217;ve accumulated $106K in [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":20,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"content-type":"","om_disable_all_campaigns":false,"_lmt_disableupdate":"no","_lmt_disable":"","_uf_show_specific_survey":0,"_uf_disable_surveys":false,"footnotes":""},"categories":[290],"class_list":["post-125717","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-podcast-episodes"],"acf":[],"aioseo_notices":[],"modified_by":"Aaron","_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/125717","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/20"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=125717"}],"version-history":[{"count":3,"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/125717\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":125723,"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/125717\/revisions\/125723"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=125717"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=125717"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}